ID Card (noun) – a card bearing identifying data (as age or organizational membership) about the individual whose name appears thereon.
Betcha thought this was going to be a post about the TSA. It’s not. It’s about Budget Rent-A-Car. And Germans. And their rules.
Last Sunday my friend and I planned to head down to the Stuttgart region for the day to visit her family. I had reserved an automatic car from Budget at Frankfurt Airport–because I don’t drive stick shift–and a back-up from Hertz just in case (which happened to be a BMW 6 Series convertible!). Last time I did this, Budget claimed they did not have any automatic cars, but this time they had one. But there was another problem.
My interaction with the attendant went something like this:
Attendant: May I have your ID please?
(I handed over my driver’s licence)
Attendant: No, this is your driver’s licence, I need your ID.
Me: This is my ID.
Attendant: No, this is your license.
Me: It has my name name and address on it. My picture too.
Attendant: Yes, but it is not issued by the government.
Me: Yes it is. Look a the top of the card.
Attendant: I realize that, but this is your driver’s licence. I need a government-issued ID, not license.
Me (chuckling): This is an ID…an identification card…it identifies me. You can see my picture. The credit card name matches. I don’t have a national ID card. They are not issued.
Attendant: Where is your passport?
Me: At home. I am just going to Stutgarrt.
Attendant: It is not possible to give you the car.
Me: Because you don’t know it’s me?
Attendant: Becuase I need to see your ID.
* * *
Thankfully, my friend had an “ID” card of the German variant, and presented it. We got the car. And it was a blessing in a way–she did all the driving!
But please, don’t tell me that a driver’s licence issued by the State of California with all the pertinent information on it is not an ID. The picture on the card matched me. The name on the card matched the car reservation and the credit card. It even had the glittery “official” seal on it that Germans love. A passport was NOT requried (though I will be sure to bring it along next time), only an “ID card”.
While I do love Germans and their order and discipline, this seems to be another “rule” that is devoid of reason and logic. Or am I missing something?
well, here’s a similar story, @ LAX TSA security line, in front of me was a Philipino passenger showing his Phillipines’ driver’s license issued by the Phillipine government and of course the TSA officer said he needs to see a government issued ID which in this case it should be clarified or specified as a US government issued ID otherwise show me your passport.
You are all missing something. Why would this be such a major argument? Why is the US the only “place” that lets you use you DL as an ID even though it is has been argued many times in the US, and always made clear that the DL is NOT an ID? Sounds like something fishy going on in the US, again. The answer is obvious but its not your ignorance that blinds you this time, its your inability to accept truth. The person listed on the drivers license is NOT you. Why else does it not identify you, because it isnt you silly. Furthermore the license isnt yours either. Why is your picture on there along a short description of your person? Well you are the authorized user. And even further than that the name on your credit cards and bank account sadly, isn’t you either. Living people dont have “last” names. Ask anyone foreign to the US . They will say no, we have a surname. Because the US lies to you. Another hard one to accept I know. But they always have why would you think they stopped? Pull your head out of hiding and research the laws of the USA. Its you duty to figure what is going on. Your fellow Americans have been trying to tell you something. And you call them names. Even though “conspiracy theroist are usual a bit off target they are a lot closer than you are. It is your duty as an American and therfore your duty to the rest of the world to fix the problem , How? By simply understanding what is going on in the US . Thats all just look into it.
I see it here too in the US when entering bars. Foreign students here on a visa need to show their passports, since foreign driver’s licenses are often printed in the native language and/or look forged (printed paper, not cards).
She wasn’t wrong.
Your “government” is the federal government of the USA. The entity that issues your passport. If you were European it would be the entity that issues your ID card.
The drivers license is a document showing that you know how to drive, and is issued by an organization called “California” (or whatever state you’re from).
As much as Americans and Canadians treat drivers licenses as ID, they are nothing of the sort. It’s possible that I had to show a birth certificate when I got my drivers license at age 16, but equally possible that my dad just signed a paper. Sadly, it’s been too long ago. From there I’ve switched countries and states several times, using the previous license as all the documentation needed to get the next.
My passport, on the other hand, was a much more tedious document to acquire, and is clearly issued by my country for the explicit purpose of identifying me.
I second Ron.
Mathew–sorry, you are mistaken. Driver license is not the same as an ID in many countries. Although here in US, most people only possess driver license as an alternative way to show their identification.
Well Matt, as a standard practice foreign government issued ID is only passport. Same holds true in US as well. When I first rented a car in US based on my license out of US I had to present my passport as ID (they needed license too to verify I can drive 🙂 ). So, your DL is an ID only in your country. No need to make an issue out of non-issue!
I’m with the German on this one, sorry. As a South African we have a driver’s licence and a government issued ID book (it looks almost like a small passport and is used for voting etc.) If u go into a bank they will ask for ur ID or passport and explicitly state that driver’s licences cannot be used as ID. I suspect it is a security thing where licences are much less secure than passports or ID books, but on this one she was probably just following the rules, and not trying to be ignorant of what an actual ID card is.
And worse even, in South Korea, they didn’t even want to rent us a car with a Korean issued Identification Card because we were not Korean. What’s that about???
Hey Matthew,
So is this the same friend that visited you in the states and you coughed up for a Lufthansa premium ticket for her to go back home? 🙂
@Sunny: Yes indeed!
rob–sorry, you are mistaken. My government is also California and as a German, she is also familiar with the concept of federalism. This wan’t about voting or a matter of federal supremacy, this was about making sure the credit card holder was the person driving the car. Guess what? The credit card and DL matched.
You concede yourself that a DL is an ID. Otherwise, your DL would not be “all the documentation needed.”
Agreed with what some others have said, DL is generally not considered an ID in other countries. My experience has always been they expect a passport as ID and you’ll run into much more hassle trying to use anything else.
I had an issue using my driver’s license as ID in the UK. When I went for my British Library reader card, the gentleman processing my registration said that my license was sufficient as “proof of address” (I had originally brought a credit card statement with me for that) but not proof of identity or signature. Thankfully I also had my passport with me and he was more than willing to accept this and issue the reader card.
It’s interesting that my New York State license (with my signature digitally printed on to it) isn’t valid as proof, but my passport (which I signed in ink upon receipt) is.
On a similar note, in Massachusetts (where I grew up, and where a good chunk of my family and friends still live) the use of out of state driver’s licenses as proof of age is a tricky subject. Particularly it’s an issue for alcohol but I believe this applies to tobacco as well.
State law provides a defense for sellers who accept an MA license/ non driver ID or an ID issued by the Federal Government (passport, US DoD ID, etc…) that turns out to be bogus – provided a good faith attempt was made to verify its authenticity. This is not true for out of state and Canadian licenses. In these cases, the retailer would still be held liable even if all due diligence was completed.
In my experience, when I was younger (21/22) I was frequently asked for backup ID with my New York license (usually a credit card with my name on it was fine). I believe the only place I ever had an issue being served was Fenway Park, they wouldn’t accept my NYS license because I was under 25. I brought my passport with me knowing this might be an issue, went to a different concession counter and ordered my Sam Adams with no problem. I’m 27 now – I’m rarely asked for ID anymore and even when I am, now nobody seems to care my license is out of state.
‘ While I do love Germans and their order and discipline, this seems to be another “rule” that is devoid of reason and logic. ‘
What may suffice as ID in US does not suffice as ID elsewhere.
It may have been easier for the attendant to simply ask for your passport in the first place. Realize, that it’s quite difficult for these attendants to keep track of validity of documents produced by hundreds of nations, let alone 50 states in addition, although it’s not impossible to fake a passport as well.
But what the attendant was asking was not “devoid of reason and logic”.
It seems the consensus is that a DL is not a valid ID.
But it is still an ID, by definition.
I understand what others are saying but I am with you on this one Matthew. At what point does this become an issue of semantics? I have both California Driver’s license and ID card; The only difference between DL and ID is exactly that – one says DL and other ID, otherwise even the serial number is that same. I wonder what she would have said if you had the latter. I have both US Passport and US Passport Card. Will she not have accepted US Passport card because it is not in booklet form and does not say “ID”. Sometimes, all that was needed is reason and Logic. Since this IS a car rental, I would think a DL (with all the necessary identification) would be more appropriate than any ID which does not give any idea whether you have the permission to drive!
While I’ll take no stance in the “official” vs. “unofficial” argument, I will state my own experiences… I am a US citizen, legally residing permanently in the UK, and I rent cars on the continent all the time (France, Germany, Switzerland, etc.), and have never been asked to show anything other than my US driver’s license. Yes yes, I am supposed to get a British license after living here more than a year, but it’s not technically required as long as I don’t drive in Britain (which I don’t). I always rent from Hertz, though, so perhaps that’s the reason.
I had a similar situation in India and found that they were satisfied with my US passport card since it was issued by the national government (Indian drivers licenses don’t count as valid ID in India any more than a library card with a photo is what I was told). I travel with my passport card even domestically to use as ID at the TSA checkpoints so I don’t risk losing my license.
I once had to borrow a car that was stick shift. It took me about an hour, but I got the hang of it. Fast! Now if I had to do it again, I probably wouldn’t enjoy it but it’s doable. The only time I have problems is for hills because I need three legs: One for the clutch, one for the gas, and another for the brake. But the trick there is to use the emergency break and just pop it out when you’ve got the clutch engaged (didn’t try it yet though.)
Renting automatic trans cars in Germany should be more common since they have an addiction similar to us: mobile phones and many now prefer the ease of automatic transmission.
Anyways, having a lady “friend” drive you around… well… I’ll let it go!
Regarding the ID issue: It depends upon the clerk. There are some types of German women clerks that can be a bit difficult to deal with, to say the least. The men are usually a bit more laid back. Just my experience.
@John Paul
I’m trying to remember back whether I always had my passport with me for my past Hertz rentals. I honestly cannot recall.
I have had DLs in multiple countries. While most locations will accept them, I do agree with the consensus and the HertzDL employee. A California DL or a Singaporean DL in not an official form if Identification, it does however verify you have passed required driving tests.
I think it was also a Hertz rule that you were attempting to circumvent. (I think they wanted to collect a National ID for policing/EU control.) If you steal the car it is harder for them to tell interpol Matthew from California and upgrd.com stole our car. VS Matthew of USA PP# 44444 stole our car.
Basically no country outside the U.S. considers driver’s licences as I.D. – please refrain from posting ignorant stuff like this in the future.
I’m a vocal enemy of German bureaucracy but in this case the lady is 101% correct.
Quoting Matthew – “But it is still an ID, by definition.”
By definition, my health insurance card is a form of I.D., it even has a picture of me. I still wouldn’t dream of renting a car with it!
No John, I’d avise you against making such sweepingly ignorant comments in the future. I have rented a car in Switzerland and France with only my DL and even used my DL as an ID in China. So don’t pull the ignorant card.
Furthermore, no one can be 101% correct. But you knew that.
Yes, your health care card, if it does have your picture, is an ID card. The question is whether it is a valid ID.
@Mathew: So in all your travel you’ve rented cars twice on just your driving licence. That’s anecdotal evidence at best. I would bet with you that official policy at most rental car companies in both of these countries is that a form of I.D. besides the driving licence has to be produced. A long time ago, when I traveled a lot as an unaccompanied minor, I was inside airport staff rooms at least twice. That doesn’t mean all unaccompanied minors have a right to access staff rooms at airports…
A driving licence is only valid I.D. in the U.S. – it’s a crutch for the fact that the U.S. doesn’t have a nationally-issued form of I.D. besides the passport. There’s a similar system in Ireland where they came up with an “Age Card” concept – this card is only valid for proving you’re of legal drinking age within Ireland. Outside the country it’s just a piece of plastic with your picture and D.O.B. on it. The U.S. driving licence is slightly different in that it still serves as a driving licence internationally but it’s similar in that it’s I.D. function is completely null and void abroad. That doesn’t stop clueless or lenient Swiss and French rental agents from recognising it as such of course!
So a driving licence is not a form of I.D. outside of the U.S. Think about it – it doesn’t even mention your country of birth in most instances! Ohh wait, there’s also 50 versions of it, so I can’t even tell you if that’s a fact or not because it could be different on every state’s driving licence.
I hope that clears things up.
…..in Germany, Europe and most countries and in this case in Germany there are two types of ID:
– Fuehrerschein or driver’s license which is just a permit to drive
– Ausweiss or national ID and/or passport which proof your legal status in the country
Europeans can travel within non_Schengen European countries freely with national ID otherwise they need passport to visit other countries.
Similarly, post 9/11 US national requires passport to Canada, Mexico and abroad, neither driver’s license nor birth certificate.
This sort of situation is LITERALLY the only reason I purchased/carry a passport card with my latest renewal. Though I’m 2 hours from the Canadian border, my Nexus is the fastest one to go across. Plus, when my friend’s passport was stolen in Mexico City the US Consulate was able to figure things out much faster after he presented the card (couriered from the hotel by his girlfriend). It’s the closest we’ll get to a national ID for the foreseeable future.
This is a funny thread of comments 🙂
So my us government issued twic card would be valid id then? all it shows is a face (mine) and a name (also mine) and the expiration date. everything else is contained in a electronic chip on the card. without the reader all other data is useless. don’t think there would be a card reader in Germany. Obliterating presumptions by the dozens……
That should work.
You’re in a foreign country and surprised that your American Drivers license is not a valid form of ID? You call yourself an experienced traveler?! lol what a laugh. You can’t even get into most bars state side with a foreign drivers license what makes you think you can take a $20,000+ Car? Whats stopping you from using a scammed CC and a fake ID then driving off with the car to another nation? I swear sometimes people are just oblivious and self righteous to a fault.
Yes, I am surprised. First, because I lived in Germany and used that same DL many times as “ID”. Second, because the security features on a California ID card are more secure than a U.S. passport. Third, because no one is going to go through the trouble of making a fake ID card and a fake matching credit card that successfully is authorized for thousands of dollars just to drive off with a rental car that has a tracking device on it. I swear, sometimes people are just oblivious.
I remember being in a bar in the UK and they were skeptical of accepting my US state’s driver’s license as proof of age. Luckily it had the hologram so they didn’t think it was fake. However the date being written in MM-DD-YYYY confused them quite a bit. They asked me my date of birth while “hiding” the ID card and then after saying it correctly, they let me place my order.
That being said, I’ve always been told that US driver’s licenses are IDs that are issued within a country and only recognized as valid ID in that country. (They do serve as proof of driving ability outside the country.)
Whoops, italics were only supposed to be on “valid ID.” Sorry!
My gripe is if rental car companies want forms of ID beside DL why don’t they make their instructions clear before you arrive pick up car. Should be stated in bold writing when making reservations, not the small print most people dont read. If its mandatory then car rentals should ensure proper instructions otherwise what’s the point they’ll loose a sale and you dont get a car…stupid and waste of people’s time.
The US doesn’t issue a national ID to American citizens, so you can show your DL to anyone who requests an ID…for as long as you are in US territory! Outside your country the only way to truly prove your identity is by showing your passport! If I showed my Spanish ID while on vacation in the US, they would laugh at my face…what makes you think you can get away with showing your DL?
The only internationally standardised ID is a valid passport. To rent a car you should show your passport along with an INTERNATIONALLY VALID LICENCE. This goes for Americans travelling anywhere and for any other national of any country.
The international Drivers’ permit is a certified booklet that translates your licence to many languages and proves that your licence is valid back at home