Very simple: if your seatmate creeps into your personal space, you do not have to tolerate it. That’s all I need to say about a recent incident with a passenger of size extending beyond his armrest on United Airlines.
But let’s say the situation had been slightly different. Let’s say that the woman in the window seat had her arm on the armrest. My assessment would be totally different. For purposes of our discussion, I want to flesh out that nuance.
Unwanted physical contact is never okay on an airplane, but I do have some sympathy for a passenger of size in a middle seat who finds himself in an armrest battle, especially on a longer flight.
A Passenger Of Size Can Assert His Right To Middle Seat Armrest
A woman complained on reddit that her seatmate, a passenger of size (big person) seated in the center seat encroached on her space by placing his elbow on top of her arm on a United Airlines transcontinental flight.
Here are two two pictures:
images: reddit
And here’s how she described the situation:
So you’re on a 5+ hour flight with a 1.5+ hour ground delay (after boarding) beforehand and the person on the aisle required a seatbelt extender, and the person in the middle – also larger than average and from a different country/culture – encroaches into your space. They have no issue with sustained body contact and remain in the same position like an immovable statue. WWYD?
Elbow someone who outweighs you by at least 100 pounds? Try to explain through a language barrier that they need to fit in their space, when the aisle can’t fit in their own? Find the most friendly FA to take pity on you? Genuinely curious for responses, especially from the frequent flying women out there.
Again, that’s simply unacceptable, end of discussion. But what if her arm had been on the armest?
While I am not always tolerant of passengers of size demanding more space, I would find myself on the side of the larger passenger in that situation.
View From The Wing is quite right that standard etiquette for armrest distribution on an airplane includes:
- The passenger seated in the window seat gets the armrest next to the window
- The passenger seated in the aisle seat gets the armrest next to the aisle
- The passenger seated in the middle seat gets two armrests
In other words, it is not a “whoever grabs it first” rule with the middle armrests. Just because the passenger in the window, as was the case here, placed her arm down first, does not mean that the space is hers. On the contrary, that space belonged to the person seated in the middle seat.
Yes, it’s totally unacceptable for the middle seat passenger just to place his arm over her hand. I would advise contacting a flight attendant if faced with that situation (though it also wouldn’t hurt to elbow the person away).
But in our imagined scenario, Mr. Passenger Of Size could have also contacted the flight attendant asking that the woman stop touching his armrest. Again, I’m talking theoretically, as the situation here is that the passenger of size went beyond his armrest, but it is something I’ve seen on many occasions.
What do you think about this situation? Does the center armrest always belong to the passenger seated in the middle seat?
This isn’t the first time you highlight your personal animus for “people of size” in a blog article. This problem is common for people of size or “regular” sized people. Any person big or small can encroach upon the other person.
Guess you missed the part where I defend the POS in my imagined hypo. It’s about who controls armrest, no matter how large the passenger.
People of that size need to book (and pay for) two seats.
As airlines are selling more seats , why haven’t they installed more armrests ? Every passenger ought to have 2 armrests . Simple solution is to install more armrests throughout the airplane .
Middle seat gets both armrests and NOT ONE MILLIMETER more. I dont care how obese they are. If you ooze into my space I’m speaking up.
However , if you speak up , the other person will speak up back to you , and demand you give him your food .
Why is it accepted etiquette that the middle seat gets both armrests? Other than Gary says so.
Simple : the aisle seat can dangle their free arm in the aisle , and their other arm across their lap . If you happen to be right handed , you can eat with your left hand .
Yeah no shit. You’re describing one of the many reasons middle sat sucks. Maybe we should let middle seat lie down across our laps to normalize the experience further, huh? A worse situation does NOT NOT NOT NECESSARILY NECESSITATE SOME CONTRIVED ‘ETTIQUETTE’.
I have seen peaceful coexistence where 2 unrelated people share an armrest. The middle seat passenger gets most of the armrest but the window seat passenger in a row of 3 gets a tiny bit of armrest towards the seat back. This is sufficient to put a bent elbow
Matthew, these kinds of posts really make me lose interest in the blog… Page6 level articles, that don’t add any value to your website.
LiveAndLetsFly is turning more and more into a gossip girl grade kinda website…
Yeah, someone shouldn’t spill over into ones seat, yeah, someone shouldn’t steal low grade blue cheese from a lounge, yeah, a dog shouldn’t p**p in the isle of a plane, etc, etc.
Please focus on the tripreports. Its something I really value and I consider your blog to be the best in the field. But recently you’ve been posting so much random and unnecessary stuff. Please don’t take this then wrong way…but stop posting low quality click bait articles
I used to think like you do, but I’ve changed over time. I think there is value in these stories because it opens the discussion for plane etiquette. It was only after reading blog posts like this that I came to the agreement in my mind that the middle seat guy should get both armrests.
You know there is no written rules on plane etiquette. You simply learned them over time. I think discussing in this format is a valid way to come to some agreement in the absence of written rules.
So I don’t view these as just gossip columns. But as educational tools.
@NiCr: If I want this blog to be self-sustaible and underwrite my review trips, I need stories like this. See here:
https://liveandletsfly.com/travel-blogging-2022/
A story like this will do 10x the traffic as my KLM A330 business class review form yesteday, that coincidentially tok about 10x longer to write.
If you want less of these stories, get more people to read my reiews and also support this site by signing up for credit cards using the links on the rihgt side of the page.
My issue isn’t with the “who gets the arm rest”. It is more about air-rights above. Since covid, I have begun to recognize my personal space. I’m willing to pay more for having the seat open next to me, but unable to book that in the same PNR, and must go thru many obstacles to get that extra space – I’ve taken to paying for FC upfront.
In economy seating, I do not need the extra legroom, but extra seat width. From a small woman with a 27” laptop elbowing me “over the armrest” to the overlap of a person of size’s shoulder touching me as I try to lean away from “their armrest” as they intrude into the space above and into the “air-rights” directly above my seat.
If on an aisle, my leaning get me hit by backpack, purses during boarding, and by the FA during aisle service. The window seats on some plane curve inward only a few inches from the window armrest; sitting there turns my body position into a contortionist.
My fix – solution – for this, is 5 across seating on narrow body planes; the 2 seats on the left side – facing forward – would be the E+ seats, and the right side regular economy. The seats on the left would have both larger seat pitch and width. This type of configuration would allow for E+ to be either window or aisle – no middle seats!
There are bonuses too. The right side would allow for sales to move all the way forward for a fee. The other…if E+ doesn’t fill the full left side of the plane, they can be available for a fee 24 hours before departure during checkin.
A drawback would be HUB-HUB flights that would have GS/1K at the back of the airplane albeit on the good left side.
While I think your protocol standards are nice in theory, I’m not sure they stand up to the real world circumstances. It’s a lot like The Pirate’s Code: more of a set of guidelines than rules and people will do as they like for the most part. One thing that I find fascinating is how people who scream that it’s fine to recline into someone else’s space – obviously this is purely a choice – will take the opposite tack when a person who is not capable of suddenly shrinking is taking up some space from them due to size constraints. That comes across as kind of hypocritical. I will say that the pictured person in this case is seriously lacking in social graces.
I have told this story before. Full flight, only economy, my only option was window, while I am an aisle normally. They didn’t shut the door, and I was hopeful that the middle was going to be empty. Nope. AA suits filled every last seat. My middle was a big kind lady that spilled into at least 1/3 of my seat. She apologized and explained she was trying to get home early for her kids and I could relate. I spent 3 hrs on my right hip attached to the window unable to move . I retell this because it’s almost mother’s day and some things need to be remembered. Love your mum.
Decades ago I sat next to a woman in the middle seat who was jabbing her right elbow into me, well beyond the armrest. I asked her to keep her elbow out of my space. She said “You get the armrest to your right.” I said I’d never heard of that rule. She said “Everybody knows it.” I said, that’s fine; all I want is the space above my own seat. She ignored me. So I took out my clipboard, placed it vertically between my butt and the armrest, and jammed it toward the armrest with my elbow. (So her elbow was on the armrest against the clipboard on one side and mine was against it on the other.) She didn’t say anything and I kept it there for the rest of the flight.
Middle DOES NOT NECESSARILY get both armrests. Sorry 50%of us don’t agree with your ‘ettiquete.
First come, first serve?
Geez, people like you are why I don’t fly in coach.
I recently flew from Newark to Houston ( 3.5 hours) with a 90 minute ground stop. I had the aisle and a large woman was stuck in the middle. She was mindful of the space situation but simply by virtue of her size she overflowed into both the aisle and window space making for a tight squeeze for all of us. She put her purse under her seat sc the bins were full, which left her legs sprawling into both my area and the window.
Not sure what could have been done since the flight was completely full, but it did remind me that people of size have an out of proportion effect on those around them.
When you’re flying you are dealing with HUMAN BEHAVIOR good or bad, and that is never easy. And the Flt Att policing, going up and down the aisle, are sometimes of no help.
I actually find these etiquette questions very interesting and to me they make the blog more readable. What I don’t like is the encroachment of adverts particularly and the pip inserts that obstruct trading the blog on my phone.
Rich – I really like your “solution”, in the future I will be putting into my carry on a long clipboard. I am tired of the overly large people spilling over into my PAID FOR space with impunity.
It is not always as simple as it sounds. I am 230lbs and do not need a seat belt extension, in fact I have a lot of play left. I am fairly broad across the shoulders. When I sit in a standard seat my arms naturally fit on the arm rests. To do otherwise I would have to fold my arms for the entire trip (if is was in a center seat)). I the aisle seat I get bumped regularly but I try and sit there all the time.
I viciously defend my personal space. I have the to exactly as many inches as a fat guy. If you dont fit in the seat you dont wanna sit next to me