On the heels of historic pilot contracts, one labor group at American Airlines is also looking for a me-too revision to its deal, others will follow.
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American Airlines Flight Attendants Ready to Strike
The headline from this website read: “American Airlines Flight Attendants Want Up To $92/Hour, Plan Strike Vote” this week. Matthew wrote:
“…the union and company are far apart. Under one proposal, the APFA is asking for a:
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35% immediate pay increase
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6% pay increase in subsequent years
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boarding pay
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bonuses for international flights and working premium cabins”
To be clear, the $92.13/hour would only be eligible for flight attendants in their 13th year. However, if those FAs were to work a standard 40-hour work week (they may not, but that’s standard for most US employees.) For that, they would earn a base pay of $185,000/year, but wait, there’s more! Because many of those FAs would have seniority, their ability to secure international flights, and premium cabins they would earn even more.
Matthew goes into why this is unnecessary in the above-linked post and if you haven’t had a chance to read it, go do it; his points are fair and reasoned.
I’ll touch on something he mentioned and emphasize it further. He mentions that there are so many applicants that airlines have lower acceptance rates than Ivy League schools but there’s more to discuss. Pilots have been able to secure such great (I have argued “unsustainable”) deals because the barrier to entry for becoming a pilot is high and there’s a pilot shortage. They are utilizing supply and demand, but for flight attendants, the position doesn’t face a shortage so the sole concern for the airline is a temporary disruption of service.
American Airlines Pilots Want Revisions to Historic Deal
Delta Air Lines led the way with its best-in-the-industry deal. American Airlines followed with a deal that stole Delta’s thunder promising up to $600,000 for its top pilots. United recently joined the party and completed its own pilot deal, but now American Airlines pilots want to revisit their newly inked contract.
It didn’t take long, American Airlines pilots can now throw another “bil” on the pile moving the value of the deal from $8bn to $9bn for the entire contract. It’s reminscent of a scene in Succession but I can’t decide who is the airline and who is the APA in this situation (caution, caution, caution, NSFW language, caution).
The head of the APA had this to say just seven weeks after signing the most lucrative deal in the union’s history and for its member pilots:
“Last week, APA President Ed Sicher said in a statement it is “dead obvious” their union’s existing tentative agreement is “woefully deficient by comparison” to the tentative agreement reached by its competitor airline’s pilots.” – CNN
Yet here was his statement when he announced the deal with American in mid-May:
“In a message to pilots a week ago, APA President Ed Sicher wrote, “There are reports that the overall valuation of the contract would be the largest in the history of the airline industry – and they are accurate, as this agreement will be historic.” – Forbes
A deal Sicher described as historic inside of 8 weeks ago, the largest in the aviation industry (not just North America) is now “woefully deficient.”
Matthew described that deal as “obscene” and I described the deal as “unsustainable” assuming that we don’t continue to see quarter after quarter of all-time-high travel demand. Many pilots wrote in to say that the deal seemed fair, but none at the time said it was deficient. Nothing in the industry has changed over the last eight weeks other than United pilots negotiating a better deal.
Other Labor Sectors
What started as a necessry contract revision that was years overdue for commercial pilots reflected a shortage in pilot supply. But now that the wallet of the airlines has been opened, it’s no longer about an airline pilot shortage but a reckoning other labor groups may feel they are due.
They could be right.
This site covered the mechanics labor struggles specifically with American Airlines for years, but baggage handlers, counter staff, reservation agents, and even middle level executives may make their voice heard. North American airlines have little position to turn down these groups as they have shown that they will negotiate nearly any deal to continue to operate air travel. Consequences be damned.
When Will It End?
These me-too deals will have to stop at some point. Should Delta be worried that they need to revise their agreement up too? Flight attendants for American may get their deal, but then United, Delta, and Southwest Airlines will face the same challenges. With such huge increases based initially on demand for pilots, how can carriers in the United States continue to sign these deals and remain in business to pay them?
Further, yes there is record profit for carriers, but there’s also record demand. When demand drops and these other labor groups add in their deals as well, is it not obvious that carriers will struggle not only to remain profitable but to remain solvent if a pullback is substantial enough?
What then happens to these deals if the carriers can’t pay for them? Do they not become insolvent and get broken up in bankruptcy court? All of the gains received disappear under reorganization so does it not make more sense to achieve a deal that doesn’t place as much pressure on airlines to perform when this has been a challenge during slow periods in the past?
Conclusion
Labor groups watching the pilot negotiations have started to speak up about their own contracts. It will only be a matter of time before each labor group is angling for their own “historic” deal but at some point the gravy train has to end. It may be at the negotiation table, or it may be when the travel industry demand slows and airlines are left holding the bag. Some of these increases might be overdue, but airlines largely took heavy losses during COVID, so it seems fair that now that demand has returned, they should recover some profits. Only time will tell what happens in these many labor groups, the only question is whether that will be years… or another seven weeks.
What do you think?
Kyle, flight crew work 1000 flight hours a year typically, not 2000 flight hours. Your salary estimate is way off.
I think AA is tanking their profits ahead of FA negotiations so they can cry poor and stiff the FAs.
@Esquiar – I already provided the caveat about hours, and flight hours wouldn’t incur boarding times which FAs are now also paid for so your estimate too would have to adjust.
Your post says $185k “base pay.” For flight crew, base salary is hourly rate x ~1000 flight hours. Of course you know that 1000 flight hours implies a significant number of non-flight working hours. The flight hour wage has to be inflated to account for the unpaid working time.
To be clear, I am not pro-FA, but you have to be even handed. No FA is making $185k total pay without working hella overtime
@Esquiar – Respectfully, you’re ignoring two key points. Immediately before I include the $185k number I wrote this: “To be clear, the $92.13/hour would only be eligible for flight attendants in their 13th year. However, if those FAs were to work a standard 40-hour work week (they may not, but that’s standard for most US employees.)” – full of caveats.
But the second is when you say “Of course you know that 1000 flight hours implies a significant number of non-flight working hours. The flight hour wage has to be inflated to account for the unpaid working time.” but as outlined in this new contract, FAs are now paid for boarding when is part of what was part of what you called “non-flight working hours.” Now those hours *are* paid which brings the total compensated hours number up.
Take a flight from Houston to Oklahoma City, the former flight hours would be about 75 minutes, but now, add in boarding and disembarkation. Even at a brisk 20 minutes each (unlikely but let’s aim for efficiency) the total compensated time at the new hourly rate jumps to 115 minutes, nearly double. As stated, only very senior FAs would qualify for the top level of compensation under the proposed plan, but those would likely come on international routes where they will receive bonuses for both premium cabins (which they are likely able to secure), international bonuses, and a far longer boarding and disembarkation process that could be an hour or more on each side of the trip.
I’m not sure how this new contract with AA is going to work (if approved), but at DL boarding pay is half the hourly rate and is typically worth 40 minutes of pay.
No FA works 40 hrs/wk. I know you put a caveat in for the hours worked but then said 40hrs/week is standard and used it to calculate the annual salary. You can’t use bogus numbers to make a point and then get defensive when people call you on it, caveat or not.
Mike – Let’s toss the annual number out. Let’s do that, we have the power. It’s gone. Let’s say it’s half that, fair? Other commenters suggest that it is. Now add back in boarding pay which is 40-70 minutes depending on the aircraft size, domestic or international, etc. That’s now paid. So if you have a junior FA who is running ORD-DSM-DFW-SAT-DFW-MCI-ORD-IND for a day, that’s an extra 280 minutes or 4.3 hours of pay that doesn’t get factored into the old model. Let’s look at one for senior FAs holding premium lines on international routes. They are getting paid an extra 1.2-1.5 hours for boarding, plus premium cabin bonuses, plus international bonuses. That’s not apples to apples for just the rate increase. It’s more money, and more hours, plus bonuses.
Perhaps my hours number remains incorrect even with getting paid for boarding. Let’s assume that to be the case. How far off is it with these addiitonal hours, band bonuses? Still half? It can’t be and I’d suspect that since most of the lines are short domestic hauls, this number is actually way more important that proponents of these deals will let on.
I’m just going to pile on with the others who have pointed out that your salary estimate is way off and you should correct the story. Average pay is probably 75-85 hours per month.
This goes for both pilots and flight attendants, we get paid from when the boarding door closes to when it opens. It is not unusual to work a 12 hour day with 3 flight segments and only get paid for 6 hours. Comparing it to a 40hr work week is ridiculous.
@Ren – Are you factoring in boarding time which is now paid as well, or nah?
I can’t say I’ve ever met a FA who works 160 flight hours a month. Typically closer to 80-120. The hourly wages are so high for a relatively unskilled position precisely because they don’t work a 40-hour work week. It makes no sense why you would base their annual salary off of a workload that they don’t work just because “that’s what most people do”.
Yes, the hourly pay is high on paper, but name another job where you are required to be at work, doing necessary work duties, and not getting paid. That’s why starting wages at mainlines is $28-32 an hour. I know FAs want boarding pay too and that’s a whole other can of worms, but it’s just silly to act like FAs are working 40 flight hours a week. Regardless, most of us will always closer to poverty than we are to being a billionaire, so I really think complaining about others making more money is fruitless
@Andrew – If we are quibbling about math and numerical analogies – everyone is closer to poverty than to being a billionaire.
Do your monthly hour estimates include boarding?
Delta and SkyWest are the only carriers that offer boarding pay. Not sure where you got the impression all these airlines are offering boarding pay now.
Imagine working 80 hours a month, earning six figures all-in, and still complaining about how hArD yOuR jOb iS!1!
Flight attendants are a joke.
Until your granny has a heart attack or your toddler starts choking on a gummy bear in flight , at that point you may consider them less of a joke.
This is one of the worst pieces of airline industry journalism I’ve ever read. The author and editor are both morons. Please do some actual research on how this industry functions. If you read this article and thought this author makes a good point, you’re a moron, too.
Not as much of a joke as you and your crabby comments are, lorKaren. You’re a rude demeaning hag who needs a visit ti charm school. Hate us cause you aint us. #yourethejoke #bye
Unsustainable.
Delta will not be reopening their deal apart from any me too clauses that are already in it because it’s done and signed.
The AA pilots are in a unique position with an unsigned TA just about to be voted on just as a competitor iOS the game. In this case AA has likely decided that it’s in their interests to essentially match United and get the deal done vice having it voted down and potentially spending months getting another deal done as a result.
I think what your going to see is most carriers essentially going to the same place economically as these deals are essentially setting the market rate for what a pilot is worth.
Where’s the article about the obscene CEO pay? You could pay about 30 pilots for what one of these CEOs make.
An airline could run without a $10 million CEO, but it can’t run without pilots, unless they want to become a bus company
@Billy Bob – If you frequent this blog, you’ll know we are no stranger to calling out the exceeses of CEOs taking bonuses when the airline struggles. But while the job may look easy, it’s not and different positions are compensated differently. Pilots know this and most don’t expect CEO pay. If a pilot is late to the gate consistently, there might be a write-up but likely no penalty, but if a CEO misses earnings targets (both roles may have not been single-handedly responsible for a failure to perform) the pilot isn’t the one that’s on CNBC and getting trashed online.
The average CEO pay is $550k in the US and this is at or below senior pilots for big equipment. Both roles (at those pay levels) would require lots of experience in the role, training, costly education, and high accountability. There’s fewer than 20 major airlines in the US, but there are tens of thousands of pilots. If there are only 20 roles compared with tens of thousands, which position is overpaid?
I had a whole response but my browser froze, but to sum up what i was going to say… I would say 550k is fair for a CEO. I agree they take a lot of mostly negative public attention for things that aren’t their fault, but as far as actual skills needed I would say pilot is a much more skilled profession.
Another comparison to a CEO missing an earnings report for a pilot would be overshooting the runway. Yea the CEO may get roasted on CNBC, but nobody will die. The people that hold lives in their hands should be paid the most… and I’m not saying they should be paid $10 million dollars
Senior pilots for big equipment do not make $550k per year on average. You keep claiming you’re acknowledging the difference in hours worked but then you repeat figures like this. There are regulatory limits of 1,000 hours flown in any 365 days for 121 pilots in the US. The vast majority of pilots don’t earn about 1,000 hours pay per year and no major Us airline pays $550 per hour, so once again you’re assuming they are paid for significantly more hours than the reality.
@Mike – The new contracts say they will. In fact, American said it would pay up to $590k for senior pilots. Then United made a better deal, and American upped the offer from $8bn to $9bn, a 12.5% increase on top of the “historic” prior contract from six weeks ago. Your number is low, at least if we are listening to both the pilots unions and the airlines. But hey, maybe you know better.
I’m surprised with all your experience that you have no clue. It’s virtually impossible to work 40 hours per month unless you only have 4 days off. More realistic example of a workweek for a relatively senior flight attendant:
A flight from Houston to Paris round trip is 20 hours. It includes 24 hours on the layover for a 3 day work week. That does sound creamy but the only way to add hours would be to fly 4 one day trips at 6 hours pay each=That would add up to 104 hours and 8 days off per month even if it were possible to find that 1 day trip. More realistic is a less senior flight attendant flying a four day trip(gone from home 4 days) worth 20 hours pay=80 hours per month. It’s not unrealistic for any traveling job to have less than 3 days off per month. So that creay Paris trip probably requires 20 years of seniority to hold. Seniority is the name of the game in any flying position. Don’t judge someone if you haven’t walked in their shoes. I walked in those shoes for 35 years. You need to get the facts straight.
@DON BRANTLEY – Seniority was mentioned, and you’re still using the old accounting method that does not account for boarding time. but let’s look past the hours calculation for a moment and answer one simple question – is there an FA shortage that justifies payment for substantially more hours monthly and a 35% pay raise?
It seems like everyone has their politically charged slant on the issues they follow. I read this whole article and frightfully see all the right wing talking points that typically ensue what is described as research from a known and appreciated source. I conceed the fact that economics has its ups and downs and it seems you are cherry picking moments in time or contractual benefits to justify your article. But it seems you omit the other economic facts like inflation and the need to retain the flight attendants that do get hired. Too often the new hires are quitting from lack of a living wage to the inability to see a secure future. Please recall the 2000 pilot contract where the industry decided to blame the woes on expensive pilots when in fact the industry chose to not raise fares with a convoluted array of too much capacity or too fearful of loosing market share. Deregulation of fares is the only thing that got deregulated in the 80’s while every other aspect remains the most regulated industry on earth. So if pilots and employees from across the industry are screaming to keep up with life’s challenges then delegating the rest of the staff as just the help that gets survival wages seems a bit careless. I just came off 9 days of flying 3 X LHR SFO round trips that has extracted the most productivity out of me and the company and the flying public. There is only so much productivity that can be had before a regulated industry breaks down so squeezing every ounce out of the workforce and then saying well we paid the pilots too much so you will have to wait, and if you truly follow this industry you will know that flight attendant contracts come 3 to 5 years after they have expired and inflation continues to take its toll.
@Eric Davis – This is a fair evaluation with respect to timing of pilot contracts and inflation across the industry. However, we may have a different view on the capacity of the economy to absorb price increases. Economics would say if you increase price you reduce tickets sold. At 35-40% (depending on which contract we look at it) we agree that airlines will have to increase their prices, but here inlies where we differ. We agree costs will rise so prices will rise, but I don’t think the economy will continue to support those prices with its current level of unprecedented demand especially at the accelerated pace of several of the contracts. When food costs jump 20%, people change brands and habits, but food is not optional, travel is.
My point of this (and other related articles) is not whether pilots, flight attendants, or rampers should be earning more; rather, it’s that these unprecedented increases are based in a period of unprecedented growth. If the growth shuts off and demand drops, but the labor costs stay high, it’s merely a math problem with a logical conclusion.
The concern with pilots is that it’s a specialized job with high requirements and a limited (and diminishing) supply pool. But the other roles aren’t in the same position of scarcity. So writing contracts with similar raises because you can afford them in, frankly, unbelievably successful periods only sets the airlines up for failure with an economic correction.
Airline profits are through the roof, planes are filled to the gills… But the airlines get upset when unionization says “Slow down on the record profits bad boy…. Who do you think is making this happen? Not stockholders.”
Labor is an expense in capitalism. Capitalists need to remember that.
I think your numbers are way off. I’m a Ramper for AA and for the most part FA’s make yearly about the same as I do considering how their work time is calculated. I work my 40 hours per week and put in some very modest overtime. Some put in way more than I do. I earned $79,000 plus $6,000 in 401K contributions. Currently to reach that pay for a Ramper it takes 12 years in the trenches. Meaning a 12 year payscale.
The FA’s have a 13 year payscale.
Now yes I’ll admit the raises sound extraordinary but for Senior employees you forget that we were mired in concessions for close to 20 years with very meager raises. We’re now just trying to make up for those loses. And since at least at the moment supply and demand is putting us in the drivers seat why shouldn’t we capitalize on that? Inflation will take much of it back anyway in time.
I wonder if management will ever pay for such an increase? Or will the people? The people / passengers will be the ones to foot the bill. Maybe they’ll just cancel flights to save money? Or hire pilots and staff by contract externally from outside the union to save money?
$185,000 for 160 flight hours a month?! LOL Most senior flight attendants fly less than 80 hours a month. In what world is $95,000 a year annually considered rich in 2023 You can get your CDL in less time it takes to become a flight attendant and make far more at some trucking companies.
If US airlines ever want to improve their inflight service, they’re going to have start investing in their flight attendants. Its discouraging that the unions aren’t asking for more.
Dude, stop arguing with those who work in the industry. A 40 hour work week would be 160+ hours a month. There is no such thing. A flight attendant making $92 an hour is making 90k a year.
This is terrible journalism.
We’re quibbling about math because you’ve made it the main thrust of your article. To make $185k a year at $92/hr, means 2000+ hours. Even with boarding included, FAs are not getting 2000 hours a year of pay. And bear in mind, that pay rate also goes towards the fact that one is away from home for more of the month than not. Even time spent in a hotel is time spent in the service of the schedule the company sets, and it’s time away – all uncompensated beyond a per diem that usually does not even match Federal minimums.