During a Minnesota State Senate hearing this week, a Senator called a Delta Air Lines pilot a “stewardess.” She was not amused…
Delta Pilot Called Stewardess: Innocent Mistake?
During a Senator Labor Committee hearing on sick time his week, Minnesota Republican State Senator Gene Dornink had the following exchange with Laura Haynor, a Delta First Officer who spoke on behalf of the Air Line Pilots Association International (ALPA):
Dornink: “Can you tell me what a typical work week looks like for you as a stewardess?”
Haynor: “I’m a first officer for Delta.”
Dornink: “Pardon me?”
Haynor: “I’m a pilot.”
Dornink: “I’m sorry, I apologize. I don’t know why I said that, I’m so sorry.”
The look on Haynor’s face…
I have an idea why Dornink made that mistake…
The committee is considering whether to modify the state’s earned sick and safe time law.
These issues often turn into partisan battles and many are insisting that Dornink knew exactly what he was doing. I’m not sure that is the case…his apology sounded sincere to me and certainly exposes an implicit bias, but not any malice.
That implicit bias is something he needs to ponder…and hopefully, he will never make this sort of mistake again, for it does not reflect well upon him. But if this is a learning moment and causes reflection, then there is no lingering harm or foul…
What do you think?
image + video: Minnesota State Senate
Not a good look for the State Senator, Matthew, but I’m inclined to agree with you.
She introduced herself as a piolet representing this pilot’s association. Whole thing seems weird
Innocent mistake , for which he apologized .
I still own a set of TWA stewardess wings which was given to me by a grateful TWA stewardess .
American people have lost their sense of humor : this is a good “DEI” joke .
“this is a good “DEI” joke”
Nothing to do with DEI, and I don’t think there was any humor behind what he said, whether a simple mistake or more.
@Aaron … you have proved my point : we need a population which includes those who believe in humor , or, making fun of oneself . Some people prefer a smoking section ; I have always preferred the self-satirizing section . I can always have a good laugh at my own expense . Keeps me from becoming pompous .
Oh, humor is a good thing, when it’s available. And making fun of others while trying to hide behind a “people need to laugh at themselves/be more humorous” shield isn’t the same as literally laughing at oneself in a self-deprecating way.
I disagree about the exchange being an “innocent mistake.” He said it to belittle and to dismiss her. Why do I say this? Because she introduced herself not only as a pilot – but as a representative of an international PILOT organization. I can give some people the benefit of doubt if they make presumptions based on appearance. They lose it once they are told the facts but persist in denigrating someone’s professional accomplishments. And if you see my website below and still have questions, I am an attorney who has been licensed to practice law in the State of Texas for more than 30 years.
Every man who supports this guy is precisely what is wrong with the world. Please go to mars so this planet can finally progress without you and your sexism.
Sounds like implicit bias more than anything else. Granted, it is hard to arrive at a conclusion without knowing if he has made previous gaffes like this constantly or not.
@Aaron … once I was pulled over by a traffic officer , and I asked him if he would give me a commendation for good driving ? He laughed .
I mean, good for you, but who cares? It isn’t remotely related to this subject at all.
Embarrassing but a lesson quickly learned.
He said sorry twice and did not sound sarcastic. Therefore, I consider his apology as genuine.
Flight attendants should not be offended by the term “stewardess”. The reason I see for the change to flight attendant is to eliminate the gender description of stewardess versus steward. There is nothing wrong with being a stewardess or steward.
My take is different from all previous comments above. My take is that public comments and hearings are just for show. Politicians already made up their minds. In fact, as a state senator, Obama asked real questions and was pulled over to the side by another senator and told to do his homework at home. The bottom line is that testimony is not for the politician to hear, ponder, and consider. Public comment is just for show to pretend that it is a democracy.
In our town, there used to be public comment then, immediately afterwards, the city council would vote on an ordinance with no discussion, no considering slight amendments suggested by the public. It was obvious to everyone in the room that the public comment was for show, just like voting in a dictatorship is just for show.
@derek … please share : what were Obama’s real questions ?
He was fact finding when the other senator wanted him to shut his mouth.
Obama is not stupid. He’s a slick politician. So then he stopped asking fact finding questions and just used senate hearings as theater.
Derek… did you watch the video ? Lol. We aren’t talking so much about FA being called a stewardess but a woman who is a pilot being called a stewardess. I believe it was an honest mistake but this is something many women I fly with constantly deal with and out of respect for them I say this is an unacceptable mistake T this point.
The point of the problem was that she was neither a “stewardess” nor a “flight attendant.” SHE WAS A PILOT. The senator was showing his bias by assuming that a woman could not have a position of authority requiring technical training and expertise.
“The senator was showing his bias by assuming that a woman could not have a position of authority requiring technical training and expertise.”
I’m chuckling because did you just imply that a Flight Attendant doesn’t have technical training or expertise and that there aren’t senior attendants in a position of authority?
Regarding the “implicit bias”: I just goggled and found that 75.2% of FA’s are women. Where’s the DEI initiative to hire more men as FA’s?
Men who apply are at no disadvantage. There’d be more male flight attendants if more men applied.
I think he made a “joke” that didn’t land, and so he tried walking it back. This isn’t okay, and if it was a mistake, then he merely spoke his true thoughts. which isn’t good either.
LOL, she said the word “pilot” FOUR TIMES at the beginning of the video. Clearly he was not listening at all!
It’s all likely an honest mistake, and wasn’t consciously trying to offend.
However, this does make one wonder about implicit bias, Implicit bias is much more systemic, and can hold sway over individuals and groups without much acknowledgement. Seeing a man and woman, and presuming the man to be the doctor and the woman a nurse. It’s expecting a nurse to be a woman, and a doctor to be a man. That’s due to how it’s been, and portrayed. People fall back to old stereotypes without realizing it.
It’s hard to break that train of thought.
It’s rooted even in our most base and vile parts of humanity. Racist posters of sinister looking Asians (the yellow scare), Jewish people with their big noses (greedy people), etc., all these things have been perpetuated and acceptable by societies at one point or another. These slights build into the psyche of individuals and groups.
The times are not changing , not in a positive way. In fact with the banning of books, loss of reproductive choice, the disappearance of decorum and civility, and a criminal that admirers dictators running for president, I expect to see women being tried for witchcraft next. This state senator said exactly what he meant to say.
Voicing rude opinions and gaslighting the public that you didn’t mean it is now commonplace. Women are inured to much of this stupidity, and that is sad in it’s own way, but I seriously doubt the pilot lost any sleep over his remarks.
@Maryland … Please share : which books have been banned ?
Go to a library. Hawaii has a banned book week to showcase many books. One of the craziest bans include the Wizard of Oz. Libraries are funded differently and have local power in this regard. And check with Florida teachers that can be arrested for displaying a banned book.
@Maryland … +1 . I do not live near a library , and I haven’t heard of a banned book week in Hawaii . Most of our books come by Amazon to the small post office . I regard ‘Alice in Wonderland’ and ‘Through the Looking Glass’ as better than ‘Wizard of Oz’ . Related to aviation : When Philippine Airlines crews came to Hawaii during Marcos they purchased ‘The Conjugal Dictatorship” to bring back to the Philippines , because it was banned there .
Maus.
…you’re joking, right? You can’t seriously be that ignorant about books being banned. No one can be.
That’s it. Banned books are the reason he called her a stewardess and then apologized. And witchcraft trials are indeed aound the corner.
The Wizard of Oz was banned because it exemplifies strong women. And why I include books in my comment. A woman in power seems to threaten weak men.
Killing babies isn’t and shouldnt be a right.
Also porn shouldnt be allowed in schools.
You are right times are getting worse when we have groomers trying make children mutilate their bodies based on junk science.
Actually it’s getting worse because we have idiot trolls like you spewing hateful fake-news nonsense.
No one knows an embryo isn’t yet a child more than an infertile woman who desperately wants it to become one. Even in the bible, life begins at first breath, not conception. If you think that it’s all right to force people to use their bodies to sustain the “lives” of others, then it should be illegal for you to keep both kidneys and all your blood. Keeping your second kidney and all your blood is killing people who need that stuff. So let’s mandate it. Right? you recover from losing a kidney in less time than it takes to carry a fetus to term. But you want the right to your body, even if it means someone who actually IS alive dies.
I’d say your comment has nothing to do with the topic at hand, but it actually shows the problem of how many freaks think women don’t deserve to have rights.
So we should infer that she thinks stewardesses are inferior to her position?
Not a good look, either.
Why on Earth would we infer that? She gave no indication of it.
The term “stewardess” hasn’t been used in the United States since 1975. The senator holds a leadership position in a state that was the previous headquarters of Northwest Airlines and remains home to Delta’s second biggest hub, not to mention the 8,000-plus Delta workers employed in Minnesota.
So yeah, she had every right to be annoyed.
I hear the term ‘stewardess’ still used on many flights. I also hear the term ‘steward’ used on many flights when they are male. No confusion. And no insult.
Just clueless or living under a rock for the past 50 years.
Not really. She was asked to describe her weekly job routine so I am not sure how she can describe it without correcting him…. otherwise more confusing would follow…
Flight attendants have important jobs to do. The insult is when a man presumes a woman can’t be a pilot or a doctor because of her sex. Guess who is higher up in command between a pilot and flight attendant. Yeah, that’s the problem. Since she’s a woman, the presumption is that she’s the subordinate, not the one in chargre.
This crap discourages women and girls to go into fields that are massively male dominated.
The state senator/Neanderthal was totally wrong on both fronts. The proper term for a Delta FA or Customer Service agent is “waste of oxygen”.
Not many women pilots…
Why does this entitled Karen clearly think that she is far superior to a lowly flight attendant???
The implicit bias here is from the “First Officer” who is having a public temper tantrum for the sake of cameras and her Tik Tok videos.
Check yourself, lady. Oops, did I misgender? Bad boy! Oops, I did it again!
FO Haynor is not “acting superior” to a “lowly Flight Attendant”; she’s reacting to the implied sexism of the senator’s comment. Every woman who makes it into an airline cockpit has to fight twice as hard to get there as any guy. Of the two hundred or so people I’ve taught to fly, the women by and large became the better pilots. Same held true for the women I crewed with in the commuter airlines. These achievements were made in the face of continual harassment and undermining by the guys. It’s gotten a little better over the years, but there’s still a long way to go.
Sounds like someone who didn’t even watch the video but just wants to spew hateful homophobic and misogynistic nonsense.
Reminds me of when Dr. Blaisey-Ford was incredibly calm and collected, and Kavanaugh was out of control, yet she was called unhinged and he was called emotional. I can’t help but wonder what kind of delusions some people must have to see someone who is so extremely calm, and claim that they’re having a “temper tantrum.”
This comment is ridiculous, what temper tantrum? She politely corrects him and moves on. You obviously didn’t watch the video. No one said anything negative about flight attendants, she simply stated that she is a pilot in order to answer his question. What would you do different?
So when he asked her about her weekly routine as a “stewardess,” she should have talked about flying planes without correcting him, leaving him confused about why the lil’ lady isn’t talking about serving coffee and peanuts? She calmly corrected him, as she needed to do.
Also flight attendants have important jobs to do. The insult is when a man presumes a woman can’t be a pilot or a doctor because of her sex. Guess who is higher up in command between a pilot and flight attendant. Yeah, that’s the problem. Since she’s a woman, the presumption is that she’s the subordinate, not the one in chargre.
This crap discourages women and girls to go into fields that are massively male dominated.
Could it be she was annoyed by the senator not listening to her introduction that included her professional title?
We should go easy on members of the government. They’re above normal people and shouldn’t be held to a higher standard.
ITYM they are stupider than common people
Any of the above sensible comments are valid. Pick your poison but the Senator comes across looking inattentive as the absolute best and more likely ignorant and sexist.
And he is from Minnesota – the land of passive agressive behavior. A job took me there years ago and I could not wait to get out of that state.
If someone is going to be SO SENSITIVE to some mistake, then he / she does have some kind of self-image problem,.
I don’t think you watched the video. She politely corrected him, which she had to do, because she can’t answer a question about what a flight attendants schedule is like as a pilot. And then she moved on with her testimony. What would you have done different?
Women shouldn’t be pilots.
What a useless comment.
Awe Aaron. Good to hear from you again. How’s life?
Are you serious? Simply sexist? Or… just trying to stir the pot? Regardless, your comment is mean-spirited and perfectly punctuates the issue. Clearly the senator couldn’t be bothered to listen to a woman speak, she said pilot and/or pilot’s association at least 4 times.
Her position is relevant to the discussion! She is speaking on behalf of the Airline PILOT’S Association.
These sexist comments are a perfect peek into the psyche of some…
Then, we have some victim blaming mixed into the potion. The Senator did not listen, made assumptions and is clearly biased, yet many are keen to blame the speaker.
Let’s blame her. She’s doing it wrong. She’s wearing the wrong thing. (Where have I heard that before?) She’s too sensitive. She’s too big for her britches…
She’s too this… She’s too that…
Misogyny much?
Sounds like someone’s fragile fee-fees are hurt that he couldn’t pass a checkride, and is all kinds of butthurt that women, who he thinks are beneath him, can.
“I’m sorry, I apologize. I don’t know why I said that, I’m so sorry.” He doesn’t know why he said that? This Neanderthal knows exactly why he said it. It’s in his DNA and I don’t believe for one second that he’s sorry or that he will reflect and change his ideology. Clearly he’s comfortably ensconced in the 1950’s.
Awe you gonna cry about it little man?
The definition of a little man is one who is so intimidated by women that he doesn’t want women in the competition pool because he knows he can’t win.
A true STRONG man is one who is secure enough in his skills and value in the world that he would rather pull women up with him rather than punch them down.
Take a look at who the little man is.
Much as I decry the senator’s sexist comment, I need to point out that FO Haynor, dressed in her generic Delta employee uniform could easily be mistaken for a Flight Attendant. Any airline pilot testifying before congress on a matter even remotely connected with flight safety should be dressed AS A PILOT (uniform jacket, stripes, and pilot cap), so even the most reactionary of neanderthals can clearly see who they are. Asleep at the switch, ALPA?
Except she said she was a pilot at least 4 times.
It shouldn’t matter what she was wearing after she testified saying she was a pilot, but the fact is she was wearing the full pilot uniform. That is the uniform jacket with stripes, the women’s scarf, and you can’t see in this clip but she also had her hat which she took off when sitting down which(which is pretty typical), and had it placed in front of her facing out to the senators. Not all airline pilots even wear hats. So no I don’t think ALPA has any blame whatsoever for this one.
If you really decry the idiot’s comment, then you wouldn’t be blaming her for not wearing what you deem to be acceptable. Either he didn’t bother listening, or he did listen, and chose to ignore her. Not a good look for him or for you.
See you next Tuesday, Miss First Officer
Damn, someone hates women…
Come now Aaron. Just because you can’t get a woman to interact with you without paying her first doesn’t mean the rest of us hate women.
We women willingly interact with men who treat us with respect. That’s men like Aaron. No woman would willingly interact with you unless her self esteem is too low, which is usually due to cretins like you.
Aaron, I’d like to thank you for your comments in here. We women really appreciate allies. Comments like Chi’s do sting and discourage woman and girls who are interested in flying, and it really helps when we see good men call out bad men like Chi. So truly, thank you.
How did this comment pass the moderators?
Maybe if she actually wore the proper pilot uniform instead of whatever she’s got on it wouldn’t have happened.
Maybe if she said she was a pilot 5 times instead of 4 times dummies like you would have figured out she was a pilot.
That is the pilot uniform. Either way shouldn’t matter after saying she’s a pilot 4-5 times.
So you admit you’re too busy looking at her body to listen to the words she was saying. Let me guess—women shouldn’t wear skirts around you.
Lighten up, Frances.
I just briefly saw the video – the uniform doesn’t look like a standard pilots uniform – not sure if this is by design or whatnot. So he probably looked up, did not see a HAT or epaullets on the shoulders, saw wings, and just assumed.
And as someone who has worked in politics, some of the posters were spot on that he wasn’t paying too much attention, as he was readying for his own line of questions.
That is the standard pilots uniform. It seems you aren’t familiar so to clarify, the epaulets go on the shoulders of the white pilot shirt. When a pilot is in full attire with the jacket you can’t see the epaulets, instead the stripes on the jacket indicate rank. She is wearing the pilot jacket, the women’s scarf, and generally when seating indoors the hat is not worn, some companies don’t require a hat. Either way, she stated she was a pilot several times so it really shouldn’t have mattered either way.
So…he was preparing questions without knowing who he was talking to? How do you prepare questions for someone when you have no idea who they are?
Everytime I see a female or minority pilot I question their ability because I wonder if they are there because of DEI or actual abilities.
The FAA doesn’t lower the qualifications for ANYONE. If anything, women have to work harder to prove ourselves every step of the way, often putting up with sexist comments. We have to pass medical exams that were devised with men in mind, and pass the same written tests, the same checkrides, the same type ratings…and literally NONE of it is simplified. Do you really this that a conservative organization is going to make an easier version when they’re known for being so hard on everyone, including white men, including women, including everyone, that it’s like they’re getting some sort of gratification for it? Of course not. The FAA isn’t happy until none of us is happy. And the airlines can’t overrule the FAA. They have to hold us all to the same standards.
As of right now, women make up under 7% of all pilots, and only about 4% of airline pilots. Black people are an even smaller percent. If DEI really gives women and people of color an advantage, then something’s not working since there are still so few women and people of color in cockpits.
If you see a woman or person of color in a cockpit, especially a woman of color, you’ve got a pilot who had to work harder to get there than a white man had to.
If you’re worried about any moves to hire more people with disabilities and such, then it would behoove you to remember that there are jobs within the FAA that don’t require special skills. Do you think janitors who take out the trash and the cleaning people who scrub toilets need special skills? Nope. When disabled people are hired in an organization like the FAA, it’s to do those jobs, not to do jobs they aren’t qualified for.
So settle down, chad.
“Minnesota Nice?” MN State Senator Dornink wasn’t paying attention as Delta First Officer Laura Haynor spoke. While one might observe that the senator was quick to apologize, his choice of the word “Stewardess” reveals his bias as and at the same time he was quick to apologize. However, Flight Attendant is the proper term and been since 1945. It’s going to make a great skit on Saturday Night Live… I’d suggest join the Presidential election
The author of this article, and most commenters, excuse this as an “innocent mistake”. Then why is it, without knowing anything more about the senator, anyone could predict that this all-too-common demonstration of misogyny did not come from a woman of color who identifies as an Independent or a Democrat?
Your thoughts?
THANK YOU. The most innocent interpretation is that he accidentally let slip what he really thinks about where women fall by default, which is beneath the authority of a male captain. The other interpretations are even less favorable.
In the video she first thing introduced herself as a pilot representing this pilot’s association. Seems real weird that he followed up that way. Was he not paying attention, then assumed? Was it intentional to demean her and/or their group? It’s icky
It seems everyone missed that at 0:23 he calls her Toots, before he asks about the day of a stewardess.
I think this is why we need term limits.