I had a couple of cocktails at The Bank, a Marriott Design hotel in Istanbul that my friend was staying at. The hotel has a beautiful rooftop bar (even in the cold of winter when the sides are closed). I can imagine this is a very hopping place in the warmer months. We had it all to ourselves…until a mysterious woman showed up.
Who Was The Mysterious Woman At The Bank Hotel Bar In Istanbul?
As an aside, the cocktails were 800TYL (about 25USD) each, which strikes me as insane, though they were quite nice…I recommend the Hide Away and Brazen Head. Liquor is taxed heavily in Turkey.
We had the place to ourselves for awhile, then a Turkish woman strolled in. She sat down at the table next to us and ordered a martini.
She was dressed nicely, but not provocatively. She was typing on her phone while consuming her drink. Furthermore, she did not constantly look over at us, though she did a few times.
(and that’s why I am not “minding my own business” because she chose to sit next to us in an otherwise empty bar and glance over at us several times)
Before we had finished our drinks, she got up and left (she stayed about an hour).
Perhaps someone can explain to me how this works. I’m really not so naive not to recognize a woman of the night when she clearly is one (this wasn’t Lomé, Togo)…but I’m not sure this woman was.
Maybe she was waiting for her friends and they canceled on her? Maybe a date stood her up?
Ultimately, I suppose it does not matter beyond my being curious.
What do you think was going on?
Turkish women aren’t working as high end prostitutes in Istanbul hotels frequented by foreigners. Any Turkish person spending 800TL on a cocktail is very wealthy and much more culturally aligned to Western Europeans than Turkish people. My hunch, and it’s crazy… She was just enjoying a cocktail by herself. An activity enjoyed by many.
There are Turkish prostitutes that do seek out customers in a way that is sort of like what Matthew observed. Unobtrusive approach just like that. The hotel/bar employees in Turkey’s higher end places are often on the take too for these kind of situations and provide comped drinks, watered down drinks or reduced price drinks to the hotel/bar venue’s preferred “entertainment” providers to keep the men chugging along longer.
Such women aren’t all “wealthy locals” — by international standards — who feel “western” more than “Turkish”. Many of them are part of the “adult entertainment” business and make their income in just that way.
@GUW
beltway on FT says the FT rules are a bad joke. IBJoel publicly berated and suspended beltway for 30 days for a tech complaint post on the site and now the mods are coming after beltway’s signature saying just that. Any words of advice for beltway?
I was told that you were banned on FT for illegal hacking of the site without any proof of such a crime. Why haven’t you sued them for defamation and maligning your character at mod do’s? The mods and admins were being funded by IB and using IB resources to do so there and elsewhere. You still have your security clearances?
I have to agree with beltway. Their rules are a joke, at least in the prejudicial way in which they are either enforced or not or just ignored and fabricated on the fly via bizarre interpretations if anything.
Was informed that one pernickety moderator from the LA area is still annoyed that he can’t go around the forums doing “Report Bad Post” more than once every 60 seconds. I guess that kind of complaint and desire for more petty potency is sort of expected from a septuagenarian retiree.
The beltway situation is a cautionary tale: too many moderators are out of control and behaving with petty vindictiveness. So don’t contribute expecting appreciation to always come from the contributions. You might get appreciation for a while, but things can always change based on future mob dynamics when too many people go along to get along.
Where is the article about your cock?
Heh?
You were going to write about your TSA experience… I’m waiting with bated breath! haha
LOL. oh yeah. Okay, thanks for the reminder.
Didn’t know he had a rooster. Inquiring minds want to know what is the going price for a rooster in Istanbul?
A woman alone has one drink at the hotel bar. Possibly she is staying in the hotel. She picks a seat possibly because it is convenient for her or the server. And suddenly she is suspected of a nefarious activity? Really?
This why I often make my driver accompany me. Or I just stay in my room. It is my way of avoiding ridiculous judgement. What year is it anyway?
@Maryland … +1 . She may not be a Turkish person , but rather another guest .
If she had sat next to me , I would have initiated a polite “Good Evening” greeting to her .
If she had asked me if I was there on business ? I would have replied , “Sort of , but shhhhhhh …, we shan’t speak about it now. And yourself ? “
@Maryland, I offended you. I’m sorry about that because I think the world of you.
She was Turkish FWIW (or at least could speak Turkish). I just thought the whole thing weird, not because she was a woman, per se, but because who wants to go to a fancy bar alone? I certainly would never drink alone.
I travel alone a fair bit and will always visit a bar (in the hotel or outside). Not going to drink in a hotel room alone!
I’m with Maryland on this one.
A relatively wealthy or very wealthy local Turkish woman drinking alone at a higher-end bar in Istanbul? Of the ones I know, they wouldn’t do that in their own city. Firstly, they are typically very image conscious, and being alone locally like that is not taken as being good for their image nor considered safe for women in particular. They don’t trust the male drivers for taxis and sometimes not even their family or business’s hired car drivers to be around them alone when they are perceived as possibly tipsy and more vulnerable and needing to get home.
But on this my perspective is sort of skewed by being around a wealthy Turkish brat brigade that loved to be in the Turkish gossip magazines and probably even paid to get coverage at times.
@ Matthew
Thank you. You didn’t offend personally, I know I have to take steps to protect myself. It is the world we live in.
I personally love a cocktail alone, in peace, at a bar. Perhaps it’s not you, Matthew, but it’s a lot of other people. It’s down time to unwind and people watch for many. And better than sitting in your room alone and looking at a screen. People in a bar are far more entertaining and interesting in reality. And being a bar fly alone is the best way to hover around conversations and mannerisms to get a cultural dabble.
@ Stuart
I am a Catholic but just in case reincarnation exists I have made offerings to Buddha to come back as a dude. You have so much more freedom!
I’m a woman who sometimes travels alone and will often enjoy a drink in a bar especially the bar of the hotel where I am staying if I’m there for a work event.
In fact, I was just in Istanbul last week travelling alone and did go to a bar (not linked to a hotel) alone, it’s great to people watch and get a feeling for the cities nightlife.
You forget that people (women included) travel alone for various reasons and have just as much a right to enjoy the activities of the cities they are in, including drinking, as those travelling with others.
It’s fair enough – I wasn’t passing judgment on the woman, either way. But there were bout a dozen tables and she sat next to us. If she wanted to talk, why didn’t she say hello?
I agree with the prostitute assumption. Or she could be waiting for James Bond.
It’s more accepted in those cultures, although I don’t know for sure, I’ve never lived there.
In Sweden, paying a prostitute for sex is always a crime as that is what the establishment players wanted. In Turkey, paying a prostitute for sex is more accepted by the establishment players.
Funny thing is that the Eurovision Song Contest being hosted in Malmo has the country freaked out about a big explosion in sex trafficking and prostitution problems coming along with it. In Turkey, it would be pretty much business as usual when big events come to town. So yes there are cultural differences in play when it comes to how prostitution takes place and how accepted it is or is not.
Prostitute in high end hotel bars..this is often in Asian hotels.
It also happens at high-end bars in London and elsewhere in Europe. Some of the more nefarious foreign intelligence services even try to set up and keep a pseudo-honey trap/informant arrangement with the “expensive bar” women while getting “personal services” on the side using money meant to pay to exploit such assets for information, thefts and plants over time. But more typically it’s not that. It’s just a matter of money for “adult services” when it’s not a lonely or bored person with nothing better to do than to “check out the scenery” in the same was done by a guy not on the prowl.
Next time, if so intrigued, why not just start a conversation? You will know soon enough as they will make it quite obvious.
It’s sad that men assume this. I don’t even consider it. Many women travel alone, are well dressed, and drink at hotel bars. Many are quite interesting. Often more interesting than you or me as to their lives.
“Why did you sit next to me?”
“F off creep!”
No thanks.
Well, if you start a conversation with that, sure, lol.
How about, “I’ve been in Istanbul so many times but it really is amazing how vibrant it has become over the years. Truly an amazing city. Are you local here and visiting like me?
Or, “I’ve got to ask where that purse is from. It’s really incredible and would love to get similar for my wife.”
Or worse yet:
“Are you paid entertainment/a prostitute?”
Then risk getting slapped or manhandled by bar staff/security when she ends up distraught. That or you find out you approached a “working girl” who otherwise would have kept a distance from you in order to not be the one to annoy the property/bar owners/managers who don’t want the infamy of openly hosting prostitutes and exposing the formal business customers to prostitutes.
Maybe she’s even the “bartender’s” love and there to keep an eye on her love whom she doesn’t trust or whom she wants to entertain or wait for at work on a slow night before going home together. Wouldn’t be the first time to have happened at a Turkish bar.
Mom used to repeat: ” The thief judges others based on his condition.” Feel free to dissent.
I admit there’s a lot of contradictions that make this a tough one. I would normally say yes but with only the two of you in the entire place that just doesn’t seem like great odds. On the other hand, why sit at the table right next to you. OTOH there must be nice bars that have a welcoming environment for working girls so why spend big bucks on a bit of a long shot. Ultimately, I’d say that the woman was probably not a hooker but simply a lady who likely was staying at the hotel. Who knows, maybe she genuinely might have been interested in some (social) intercourse on a purely voluntary basis.
I recall around a half dozen years ago when one evening my wife – she smoked then – went outside the Grand Hyatt Bangkok to smoke a cigarette and was surrounded by, ahem, professional ladies and the men interested in their services. My wife was about 40, had on no makeup, and wore very unfashionable sweats to smoke in yet she was seriously accosted and only managed to dive in the elevator to flee with some effort. Among the lessons learned (including to avoid that hotel) was that men can easily mistake a normal woman for a prostitute even when there’s glaring evidence to the contrary.
I observed an amusing “prostitution” incident at a hotel in Buenos Aires. The hotel staff thought the blonde European tourist had brought in a dark-skinned Brazilian gigolo and so asked for the already registered male guest’s ID. Turned out the guy was an American whom I would see across the room at an event with the Menem brothers. Definitely not a prostitute.
“Why did you sit down next to me” is now my official answer to the “what’s the worst pick-up line you’ve ever heard” question.
+1 That’s funny. Adding that one to my list as well. Not even a pick up line, but said just as conversation. How do millennials even date now? Or actually meet people just for fun and conversation?
Why does everyone always assume prostitution? It’s obvious that she is a spy from a country that shall not be named coordinating with agents from another country that shall not be named.
I would say that a vast majority don’t assume prostitution. Which explains why people end up sort of surprised about or are ignorant to the prostitution that is out there at the “reputable” places where frequent business travelers stay unless and until it becomes blatantly obvious with an outright proposition/solicitation before, during or after “getting hot under the collar”.
There are a lot of naive and or even gullible people out there. I used to be one of the naive out there when it came to what goes on at “reputable” places for business travelers. But get around enough, pay attention enough and think enough and then you start to better understand what kind of behavior is out there and what you could be seeing right in front of your own eyes and will at times. Is the “dressed to kill” person a proverbial gold-digger looking for a comfortable escape abroad with something like a K-1 visa to the US? Is the person a “chica of the night”, a lonely fellow business traveler, an alcoholic, someone looking for a party drug supplier, or someone looking for a rebound hookup because of infidelity concerns? Get around enough and pay close enough attention and then you end up less surprised.
So how should a woman who simply wanted to have a drink have handled this ? Just not ever look at you? Sit as far away as possible? Both?
Grab a drink and sit in the corner reading a paper copy of The Economist after putting on the eye glasses and taking out the phone flashlight to be able to read and drink at the same time while snacking on avocado toast in between sips of nighttime tea?
Physical and verbal cues are often emitted by people who don’t want to “engage” with “random” strangers. Most of us seem to get those cues at some point, although most certainly not always perfectly.
So my friend’s at the bar now and no strange women, only tables of men looking furtively around
Matt,
I like the blog a lot, but this post seems very sheltered / naive
1) First of all, many people drink alone in hotel bars (or bars) – guests, locals, whatever. It’ s not a big deal.
2) You could have easily struck up a conversation with her if you wanted to figure out what was going on. Striking up conversations with random people at hotel bars, airport lounges, restaurants in general, etc is one of the absolute joys of travel. If you haven’t really perfected your methods of doing this in your many years of travel, I don’t really understand what you have been doing all this time
100% agree. This may be the dumbest post I’ve ever seen on this site.
Guy walks into a bar. Girl sits down and occasionally glances at him.
Guy is perplexed and writes a story about it on the Internet.
Going for a drink alone at a hotel bar isn’t unusual, I don’t think. The only slightly odd thing is that she chose to sit down right beside you in an otherwise empty place. This may be akin to a man using the urinal right beside you in an otherwise empty bank of urinals.
However, some solo travelers specifically go down to the bar not just for a drink but also social interaction and striking up a conversation with a neighbor. Maybe she just wanted a drink alone. Maybe she wanted a drink and to strike up a conversation with people but then didn’t get the feeling you were interested in chatting. As others have said, there are plenty of potential options. But yes, it’s possible she was working too. Who knows?
She’s a Russian agent. She sent a picture of you to her contact and they responded you weren’t the person they were after so she got up and left. Sounds plausible.
Jeff, it’s much worse than that. She’s a secret airline agent, trying to get Matthew in a compromising situation.
I’ll bet you dollars to doughnuts, Matthew starts posting really great reviews about PIA and Aeroflot over the next few weeks.
I have obtain a Mojito in Istanbul for $5 USD once. You were just at an expensive bar at an expensive hotel. It isn’t taxed as much as implied.
I’d say it is none of your concern. She is an adult. She wasn’t hurting you or anyone else. She can do what she wants. She wasn’t engaging with you. What amazes me is that you allow her to occupy your mind rent-free.
If she works for Turkish intelligence and was evesdropping on your conversation, then she is lousy at that job. She stood out like a ham sandwich at a synagogue.
This story drew me in as I stayed at the Bank a few months ago. Alone. As a single woman traveler. And had a drink in that bar. I was solo because I’d been on a business trip in Europe a few days previously and had decided I was going to add on a weekend in Istanbul before going home. Granted, as an American I’m used to more personal space so would not have sat next to someone when there were other places to sit, but that’s not everyone’s culture. I just didn’t feel like sitting in my room to have that drink. Maybe she’s a solo business woman who works with that market and because of that speaks Turkish. And just wanted a damn drink without judgement.
Yes. Sometimes you just want to enjoy a sunset with no bother.
A fluent Turkish speaker who isn’t Turkish and doesn’t come across verbally as being non-Turkish? Unless the person comes from Azerbaijan or another Turkic-language speaking part of Asia or the Eurasian crossroads area, that’s very unusual unless speaking Turkish or a Turkic language from a young age. And if the person were such a person and a woman, then it’s unlikely they would go alone to “get closer” to bar-drinking men for drinks in Turkey unless they were selling something. Cultural awareness varies. And for all of the “western” behavior found in Turkey, there are still things about the place that have it as culturally different even in Istanbul — for example, the ability to have an open and public conversation about the Ottoman’s genocide of Armenians or Kurdish aspirations for autonomy. Then it sort of reminds you about what it must have been like during the pre-Civil War US when John Brown would go around publicly supporting slave insurrections in places where supporters of slavery would freak out at the mere idea of it.
Let me be the first to leave a comment that has nothing to do with this woman.
Are those purple olives??
Just back olives. They were good.
Purple chips. Beets I think.