American Airlines has fired 50 flight attendants who failed to report for duty on reserve, as their contract required. The move disproportionately hits junior flight attendants but should come as no surprise to those who deliberately violated their contract by not actually being able to fly while on company time.
American Airlines Fires Derelict Junior Flight Attendants
In the seniority-based system negotiated by unions in the USA, flight attendants generally cannot “hold a line” (choose which flights they work on) for many years and may not even be assigned routes in advance until they have put in several years. Yes, the life for junior flight attendants is often the life of being on “reserve” or on-call, assigned to routes at the very last minute due to cancellations by other flight attendants.
When flight attendants call out sick at the very last-minute, an immediate replacement is required or else the flight will be delayed or cancelled. That’s where reserve flight attendants come in, who are instructed to remain near their assigned airport and be ready to report to work within 2-3 hours if called. In exchange for being “on-call” flight attendants are paid for their time, even if they are not ultimately called.
But American Airlines has seen an uptick in reserve flight attendants who will not answer the phone or who call in sick, after they have been assigned a flight. This goes against company policy.
American Airlines warned about this in a memo to flight attendants earlier this month:
We’ve talked before about the crucial role reserves play in helping keep the operation running smoothly. We depend on reserves when there’s bad weather and other factors that prevent lineholders from working their scheduled assignments. Unfortunately we continue to see some troubling trends that negatively impact running a reliable operation.
When you are on reserve, it boils down to this:
- Your are obligated to be positioned within two hours of your base airport (three hours for co-terminal bases) for the duration of your RAP (reserve availability period) unless Crew Scheduling releases you.
- If you are not positioned as described above for the duration of your RAP, you may be considered “out of base.” This may lead to the termination of your employment.
- You are required to report a known illness/injury the day prior to ROTA processing or as soon as you know you will not be available. You should not wait for Crew Scheduling to assign you a trip before calling out sick.
Many flight attendants found the memo offense, indignant that American Airlines was blaming them (at least partially) for operational disruptions. But American Airlines was not kidding and is now investigating flight attendants who failed to report as required. 50 have already been fired.
The Association of Professional Flight Attendants, the union representing AA flight attendants, has warned its members:
We have seen a significant uptick in investigations regarding reserves not in position to accept an assignment while on a Reserve Availability Period (RAP). The Company is aggressively enforcing the requirements of JCBA Section 12.H.1. You must be able to report to the airport within two (2) hours/three (3) hours for a co-terminal while serving a RAP.
If you are on Reserve and you have a triggering event such as a TM (no contact, trip missed), a MT (missed trip- you don’t show up), LC (late call out or sick on contact), or a late request of a PO, the Company will conduct a travel audit and compare it to your reserve schedule. They will conduct a 35R investigation. During this investigation, they will pull all your travel benefits history, including past, current AA listings, travel, and other airlines. They will use other evidence to substantiate their claim that a Flight Attendant was not in position to report within the contractual timeline.
Translation: American Airlines is coming after you if it suspects that you are not upholding your end of the bargain by being available within 2-3 hours when on reserve. This seems quite reasonable to me.
CONCLUSION
American Airlines has terminated 50 flight attendants who it suspected were skirting contractual obligations while being paid to be on reserve duty. More investigations are underway and the union is urging its members to exercise extreme caution while on reserve duty.
It seems to me this is a totally reasonable reaction by American Airlines to what it claims is a festering problem. While positive reinforcement might be the preferred solution from a management perspective, AA hopes its harsh tactics will persuade other flight attendants to avoid similar action going forward.
(H/T: View From the Wing)
Play stupid games…..well you know the rest.
Flight Attendant positions are amongst the most sought after jobs in the world with just a select few making the cut. It must be the culture of this post-pandemic hiring pool that is causing this. Work has become significantly less important to many. This is a serious position and applicants/new hires should remain aware of their absolute commitment to the Airline when it comes to reserve FA’s.
Lol, maybe in places other than the US.
When I was 17 in 1988 I was hired at the busiest Carl’s Jr in the world in California for $1 more an hour than my far more experienced Mexican counter parts. I was the token white kid of 50 employees. This was because they were under extreme pressure to fulfill affirmative action quotas. I certainly wasn’t the best qualified but I was the best paid. I was presented by some who saw that all I had to do was take orders. I never touched a mop. I had no problem with my fellow employees but I know I only got the job because I was white. Affirmative Action is the most racist piece of legislation ever put forth by the Democrats. It says you can’t make it without the government. You are to stupid, slow, or whatever because of your skin tone to make it on your own. I knew it was bullshit then and still is. What do you expect of a party whos reason for existence was to write Jim Crow Laws after the Civil War to write Jim Crow Laws. I am astounded when black people vote Democrat. It’s like voting to have the shackles of slavery put back on. Of course now race is just a tool. They want to enslave us all now, obviously. Racism exists but only in government. A business owner is a fool not to hire the best qualified regardless of color. Your government is totally obsessed with your skin color and race. You have to be educated to realize where racism comes from.
It is purposeful, done by our government to keep us distracted and divided. Clearly there is a pay off to be a victim of racism. Big money. The medias biggest pay days are covering race bait stories. George Floyd’s was a loser and career criminal. He died from a drug overdose of fentanyl. If the cops had shown up to serve the warrant 30 minutes later they would have found a corpse. Instead the media made billions and turned that idiot into a saint. The ignorance of the dumbed down American is entirely evident. An apparent majority elected a stupid, racist, career criminal with Alzheimer’s because they except the lies of CNN without question. CNN doesn’t care about truth. They care about money, influence, and power. Freedom is not free. Be diligent or you become a slave to dictators and control freaks. We just wore masks for 2 years, were locked down, businesses ruined, economy ruined. Some people took 4 covid shots and still got sick. Follow the trillions of dollars. I’m sure big pharma gave plenty in kick backs to cooperative politicians. To know these things requires an ability and responsibility to question everything. I have lost a huge amount of respect for the average American. The racist, terrorist, woke mob is in control and I no longer have freedom of speech. It is now time to take up arms and eliminate this tyranny. This is exactly why the forefathers gave us the ability and right to arm ourselves. They knew the tyranny is often not a foreign body. They were British subjects who were oppressed and unfairly taxed by their own government. Sound familiar? It’s time for the 2nd revolutionary war for independence. I have a list of Democrats including the governor of my own state. Given the chance I will take them out. My faith is in God. If I die I can think of no better reason than fighting for freedom like millions of Americans before me. It is my obligation. I had 50 good years and am fortunate. Previous sacrifice will not be lost on my watch. May Biden and the Democrats burn in hell. It’s where they belong.
I agree with a lot of what you said (in the first 25% of what you wrote.) You ruined it with… well you know. See, society can’t even discuss what we agree on, what we don’t, and how we could compromise. On simple topics such as affirmative action it’s most evident. If I said “I may disagree with affirmative action,” one side would call me a racist, misogynistic, climate denying, self-hating homophobic Uncle T… evil bigot, poisoned by conspiracy theorist liars, etc, etc, etc. The other side would say “Of course you may disagree with affirmative action. The people that agree with it should burn and etc, etc, etc…”
Both sides need to dissolve, disassociate, and take a deep breath. Politics shouldn’t be the binary dogmatic game it’s turned into. It’s turned into this dangerous hybrid of sport and cult. Look what it’s done to the comments of a news article about fired flight attendants… “My side good!” “No, my side good!” Yikes!
You Sir, are a certified lunatic. Your diatribe against the Govt is well written insanity. Is your life that poor that you fantasize about killing politicians in the name of freedom? News flash..It’s not God you’ll meet when all is said and done.
Oh brother, you sound like a real winner, go hug your flag
James: You are such an ignorant shmuck!!!
WOW ‼️ Your rant is without question one of the most ignorant I have ever read ! Your ignorance is overwhelming ‼️
Um, the best thing you could do for yourself , your posterity and our country is to not threaten to take people out, find yourself a good community college, take some English and grammar classes and stay off the internet. Jesus help us all.
Well and truthfully said!
I am with Darnell, about 25% of your points have much validity, although I cannot connect the dots to the original post. Freedom is not free and prejudice exists for not just race but politics, religion and independent thinking.
You might find a different forum to calmly discuss your views, understanding that most folks are not informed enough to have a conversation where one can disagree but still have a respectful conversation. Sadly, it is the world we live in and although information is more available now than in the 60’s, we are much less informed than then.
Good luck
What is this crap? You are nuts.
100% Bullseye and right on target.
I am old and lived and if necessary I too, will be side by side next to you.
Your thoughts and feelings are similar to many of us.
Bravo!
As a mature, reliable and highly efficient customer service agent I can tell you it’s the quality of people they are hiring. I have been interviewed twice with American Airlines I have a stellar reputation and work history however time and time again I see them hire 21-year-olds, who fit the “diversity “ they need to achieve, hire over me. A Caucasian, fit 40+ woman. The young men and women don’t follow the rules once they’re hired….their hair is out of compliance they’re blue nail polish and multiple ear piercings are out of compliance and don’t get me started on their work ethic.
I was with you until you said they were hired to meet the diversity minimum. No where in the article did it mention the ethnicities, genders, or sexual preferences of the people hired. Maybe there is something about you that makes them not want to hire you. Your comment here reveals that you may have inherent discrimination or bias.
No she is right. The PC culture would prevent the author from discussing diversity hiring as a cause.
Hiring mediocre or marginal people to promote “fairness” or “equality” has lead to poor service and business practices in America.
People should not be selected or dismissed BASED ON PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS!
It should ALWAYS be about your ability and fitness to perform the duties; the MOST QUALIFIED person should always be hired.
I agree with Michelle’s comments. In an industry such as the airlines (also FedEx, nursing, the military to name a few), uniformity on dress, appearance and operations is required. If you can’t conform to these standards, choose another career.
Really bringing in a stupid woke comment like that where it’s not nessasary
Ok….so she told the truth & what? You can’t handle it? Her honesty is what it is. Its how most people are now hired. HIRING IN TODAY’S WORLD IS NOT BASED ANYMORE ON THE BEST PERSON FOR THE JOB! I don’t give a flying tator your color or religion. Yes I do care about feeling like a boy one day & a girl the next! One needs mental stability to be a flight attendant!
Fab!
You are joking, right? The article didn’t mention D&I… but in case you haven’t been aWOKEn in the past 3 years let me enlighten you.
ALL MAJOR EMPLOYERS HAVE BEEN SHAMED INTO FOLLOWING THE D&I LIE!
IE: Don’t bother with the most qualified! “You may in fact be racist if you hire the qualified white person!”
It’s true, though. They have been hiring to fit a diversity quota (although I’m not privy to what the quota is, exactly). In one of our newsletters they even alluded to it in a comment. It’s a horrible practice. People should be hired based on skill and if they are a good match for the job…not on filling out their demographic bingo card.
Good point Fab! After reading her comment I immediately saw the same thing. The bitterness is real. You definitely have bias against you ma’am! Your judgements can be toxic in a work environment. You have to grow with the times. The issue here is definitely work ethic.
Fab, you are talkin right!!
I agree. She is totally right. And, it is not just in the airlines. The federal government and various other companies/corporations seem to hire that way. It all depends on the management’s philosophy.
The article did not meet it and while every company has to meet certain quotas, there are a couple of groups who respond more negatively to show up to work and meet their obligations. The work ethic of every generation is different as are with certain ethnic group (including my own) and it is different based on where you are in the country. Having worked across the entire US, some workers might complain more yet they are more apt to show up to work (and complain.) Others will smile sweetly for you and not show up. Others are on CP time and then get mad when you hold them accountable. Much of this goes to the entitlement attitude, now prevalent across more groups. It is not bias, it is real
I am a flight attendant with a mainline carrier in the USA . I have been a part of corporate hiring in events many years ago and you absolutely nailed it!!
The airlines are desperate an hire most anyone with a pulse . The typical new hire is in their 20s-mid 30s . The younger new hires simply do not have any work ethic and apparently do not care being later to the gate or late for check in . Most act if they are privileged or the rules /company policy does not apply to them .
I am 100% in favor what AA did and is doing . There’s no sugar coating when they cannot be reached for a trip assignment or say they are “sick” after being assigned a trip .
Now I can only wish my company and all airlines follow their led on this unacceptabe behavior .
Hello. I must admit, every time I see the words “flight attendant” I stop everything and read the article for I have so desired to be as such. As long as this 40 something can remember. My work ethic is extremely beneficial to whomever and I would be grateful and privileged to speak with someone , regarding how to get my foot inside the airplane door. I’m sure you didn’t expect this reply but I believe things happen for a reason and maybe you could give me the direction I need to pursue my lifelong “dream job”?I feel confident that I am highly qualified. Just need a little help getting there. Regardless, if you took the time to read all this, you must be a great person. Cheers! Angela Callahan
angicallahan@gmail.com
Love it, love it. You nailed it right on the head I so agree with American finally doing what should have been done long time ago. 100% my support
Totally agree with the comments.
Agree. I’ve be in the industry 32 years with a major carrier.
The rest of the APFA response is missing. It states the “union” disagrees with the firings. I wrote them an email stating I agree with the terminations and I did not want my dues going towards the work of getting the jobs back. This lack of work ethic doesn’t stop at no-showing or being out of base on reserve. It translates in all aspects of the job, which is very demanding . I don’t want to work with these irresponsible people. Either I pick up the slack or it doesn’t get done. It is a problem,
I totally agree with Michelle. If they want quality people, they should hire quality people!
These young ppl today do not have the same work ethics. Crazy hair & multiple piercings and tattoos are not professional. I know that I don’t want to look at that kind of mess when I’m on a plane. It’s hard to take them seriously. No doctor or lawyer comes to work like that! It’s unethical, period!
Having spent more than 25 years with TWA, several of them in Crew Scheduling, I agree whole-heartedly. When a new flight attendant was hired, he/she had full knowledge of what being a Reserve flight attendant meant. I agree with AA’s stance on this. Being on Reserve and not being available is inexcusable except in the most dire circumstance. It can cause crew move-ups, flight cancellations, and domicile seniority list inversions, among many other things. If one is only in the job for the perceived glamour, they need to leave.
So your racist @$$ just assumed the 50 that were fired are not melanin challenged? Michelle you have been passed over because I’m sure your not so subtle entitlement in hate came through the interview.
Okay…unless YOU personally know all 50 flt. Attendants were of color…you’re displaying diarrhea of the mouth! Such rubbish! The point is….hiring based on qualifications…not skin color. Boy, I sincerely hope, with your self righteous behind that you have a surgeon, dentist, pharmacist, air line pilot that was hired based on skin color…. Not if he/she can do the job and was THE best at their job! I assure you….once you encounter the mediocre within these positions…the PTSD alone will make you a drooling fool!
So what if he or she is racist. Its a free country where one gets to chose whatever the F they want to be. So shut your cock holster snowflake.
Not even what she said.
I am going to say this to everyone on this thread: Piss off ! Look in the mirror before you start calling other people racist.
I am going to say this to everyone on this thread: Piss off ! Look in the mirror before you start calling other people racist. ! Some of the comments on here are truly vomit worthy. Bunch of woke A$$ trollflakes.
Come on read between the lines man. She’s explaining the whole scenario of the process of hiring flight attendants. She not saying that they were all minorities.
But she is another persecuted white person who tells herself whatever she has to in order to avoid any actual self reflection.
I’m an operations manager and the absolute hardest problem we face is getting people to show up to work. It’s amazing. It’s old people, young people, guys, women, every background and culture… it’s people. It’s incredibly hard to find reliable people. To be as fair as I can be, I don’t see companies rewarding the people who are reliable in any meaningful way. That would help, but I’m still shocked every day by the excuses people make for their own poor behavior.
Her comment wasn’t specifically about the article but about the culture of the country in general today. The article simply proved to be a good example of hiring standards today vs decades past. We’ve all seen it, go ahead acknowledge it yourself. It’s freeing… then corrective steps can be taken..skill and experience, work ethic, ect should be hiring criteria, NOT skin color, ect…
Yout comments are spot on ! I interviewed three times having been an underpaid, extremely reliable, well groomed, straight caucasion also fit with an impeccable work record for an American airlines wholly owned regional carrier. Only to be told each time “thanks but no thanks” The woke leadership led me straight to another carrier that appreciates work ethic and reliability. Thank you American Airlines
Good on you.
You lost me at “diversity”.
It never occurred to you that perhaps YOU weren’t what they were looking for? Take a good look at thyself, oh bigot.
I have seen a big change in hiring, as a pass flight attendant…we used to have dress codes.hair codes and weight…it has nothing to do w color or sex because we always had diversity where I worked. Now i dont know who the flight attendant is and people dont respect the people working. Standards did go down.
LOL, you get your diversified flight crew and I’ll take the qualified flight crew and let darwinism work itself out you hear flaky, that make any sense to you? You get what we trying to tell you?
Same here. They turn down people who really want and respect the job, and have tried for years to get it; instead to only hire people that just wanted a job and have no respect for the flight attendant position. Now they wonder why they’re having retention issues. Thats a direct reflection of who and how they’re choosing to hire.
Well said.
I was on board to support you until you used your dog whistle term to refer to black hires. If you are a 40+ Fit, White woman who failed in her interview 2 times and you work as a CSR for American Airlines, I can guess you that your attitude and tone is visible and does not match that of a flight attendant. There’s something about you that possibly rubs the interviewer the wrong way. You showed open disdain based on racism here in a public forum so I have no doubts that you do it privately and amongst your close associates. That is not someone I want working on my line. The best flight attendant I’ve ever done trips with happened to have been a gate agent. He was hired immediately! If you already have a problem with flight attendants being “diverse“ and then using it to make excuses about multiple ear piercings and blue nail polish, then maybe you are better off having tried to fly in the 1990’s when things were “less diverse”. Flight crews are starting to match the population. There is going to be LGBTQ ,Black, Mixed, White, Asian, Polynesian, Hispanic, Mixed, Conservative, Liberal, Multi-ethnic, Male, Young, Mature, Experienced, and New Flight Attendants On the line. Get over it. Gone are the days when are flight attendants were all white women held to strict guidelines, allowing one or two black women because they were Hollywood -beautiful and couldn’t be denied.
Be careful, if you are in fact applying and have been flown out twice for a F2F, your social media might be affecting you. Be careful what you say online. Recruiters watch. Also, try to be a better person who accepts “diversity”. All qualified applicants deserve a chance to work in our industry. Among those terminated, The majority were white and none of them were cited for blue nail polish or multiple piercings. Some of then were over 40.
Did she claim she doesn’t like diversity?
Love your response Ms Holly
Your reply was very explanatory and and seemed to be factual! Some people can’t handle “no”! They have to find someone to blame. I agree that the post pandemic hires are quick to quit and walk away, but the days of bring treated bad on a job are over! People are not going for it. I’ve talked to some and their attitude is “nobody is gonna make them feel uncomfortable or unappreciated” Not to mention I’ve notice this new bully mentality when new people start on a job, But to the woman who started this….look at yourself it maybe be you. Try Southwest or Frontier….oops they won’t want you either; their flight attendance have great personalities and are actually funny!
I am a former 19 year employee at AA and AE, 90% of which was in operational management and included Flight Service Manager. Holly, your comments are spot on and the most reasonable of all that I have read here.
Michelle,…I don’t think “diversity” has anything to do with you not being hired. You obviously do NOT have a stellar work history, if your competing with people for a customer service job in your 40’s. And great reputations don’t factor in job hiring, unless it’s within the company.
If you had such a great work history and stellar reputation you would be applying for a supervisor or even a manager position. Don’t blame others for your obvious shortcomings.
With the racist view that you gave about something that you obviously know nothing about I am glad they didn’t hure you and hope that no one else will either. You do not need a job, you need a diversity program with your stinking thinking.
OK. Another racist. Hair out of compliance, blue nail polish complains 50 yr old Caucasian female.
Why not be the best you can be and fit in where you can get in? So now you know how it has been for people of color throughout history and continues to be. I know you don’t want to hear this and don’t want to accept the facts of history. You are living in changing times. Certainly not enough has changed but still times are changing and you, 50 yr old Caucasian female and the likes of you want things to stay the same so that only you can benefit.
How do you know she wants it to stay the same?
OMG, I couldn’t agree with you more . I am a retired FA since the beginning of the pandemic, best decision I made. Everything you said about the junior FAs is very true. I started the beginning of 1996, back then you really appreciated the job and the flexibility.
An important point was left out. At AA and other large airlines, the reserve pool can reach into those who have 25, even 30 years or more seniority. Not exactly “junior”. Also, life on reserve is bleak. One is on call 24/7 for most of the month. From month to month the days “on” change. Therefore, you can’t take part in regular activities (church, game nite w/friends, some volunteering, Thursday aerobics class, Friday baseball, etc.). One must also be available (showered, uniform at the ready, and under 2 hours to the secure side of the airport, no alcohol consuption) for as many as 6 days in a row. Can’t just go to a movie wirh friends or take the kids out – can’t really do anything spontaneously. Before cell phones, we had to remain by our home phone – we callled Reserve “House Arrest”. It’s one thing to force new people to make this early career sacrifice. It’s plain cruel to make employees live like this for decades.
You’re a 40+ CSR at AA. Literally bottom of the barrel in the industry. Get over yourself.
Work Ethic? Are you kidding me the majority of youth in America have No Work Ethic, everything has been given to them throughout their entire life, why would they want to work while their parents (s) have given them Dollars $$$ and coddled them and the last two and a half years the Government has paid them Not to work during the Covid-19 Pandemic. It is sad to see what goes on in life and store as I am working Partime (I am retired) at a Retail big box home improvement with lack of work ethic, don’t care attitude, call outs (Sick or just don’t want to work that day), zero customer service skills, made enough Money that week already, no career objective, unable to “Pass” a drug test, will not show up for a job interview, Quit mid-shift etc. It is amazing to witness first hand the troubled youth of today. Both of my children have held jobs while in High School and College. The both have college degrees, one in Chemical Engineering (Career at Exxon Mobil) 20 years as project manager, the second a Masters Degree in Education (School Based Technology Specialist) 17 years consecutively employed in two school systems. Enough stated.
How can a 21 year old be considered “Diversity”. The Law protects people OVER 40 – THAT Group would fall under diversity. If you’re speaking about RACE – yeah, I get the fact that so many people want to THINK they’re better than. But maybe, you aren’t.
And do your research – 66% of flight attendants working in this Country are WHITE. Your qualifications are no biggie. Check your EGO at the door. Maybe you weren’t hired because there are BETTER applicants out there. So easy to blame others when we don’t get what we want. You sound as if you’re ENTITLED.
You are completely right! They hire mediocre people who can’t spell integrity, much less embody it.
Do they let you wear your MAGA hat at work?
You’r ignorant and backward mentality is the reason you have not been hired thus far and I can only hope that future recruiters read your comments. Why don’t you just pick a different career; one that does not include human beings, created equally under God; in a location different from the one on his Earth, shared by all. Please undergo whatever type of transformation via training and education prior to attempting to place yourself in a position anywhere, with anyone. My only hope is that you don’t have children that you have now tainted. God bless you.
Sounds like you’re talking about black women!
As a FF with AA- Michelle Jobes, you are exactly who I want on my flight.
The lack of respect to authority or “the following the rules is optional” attitude is a huge problem in this country!
Unfortunately we have an entire generation who is overly entitled!
Cry cry did you know minorities have felt the same way for years. Sometimes the shoe is 9n the other foot. Now toughen up buttercup.
Michelle fails to acknowledge that most baseline “standards” for appearance are based on Eurocentric people. Not, everyone’s hair is going to be limp and stringy, for example. Additionally, D&I initiatives benefit everyone, esp a company’s bottom line. Also, let’s not forget that affirmative action and similar programs overwhelmingly benefit white women more than anyone else. So, to Michelle, the white, 40+, fit, wannabe American Airlines flight attendant: You may not be the most qualified candidate and perhaps that’s why you’re being passed over. I guarantee anyone on this thread who disagrees hasn’t had to work twice as hard to get half of what lesser qualified ppl get–which is the case with most people of color, especially women of color.
I used to like AA but since this pandemic their service has gone down significantly that I’m not a fan. I traveled several times last year and this year and I have had a few flights delayed and rescheduled due lack of staff for the flights. Kudos to AA and the new President in taking some forward steps to increase their rankings.
You are absolutely correct. Sadly, this is the trend the airlines in the US have been following and using, I know, because I work in the aviation industry.
Sought after…lmao!!
T-
Are you a flight attendant?
I am going to guess no.
FA is the only job I have ever had that I am required to put in time “on the job” and not get paid for it.
5 hour delay. Sit there in uniform and not be paid one cent. There is no other job in the world an hourly employee is forced to be at work and not be paid. Reserve shifts while yes, crucial for the company to operate, also require 12hours of on call a day and you are not paid for time spent waiting to be called. This is not a sought after position hence airlines cannot keep employees past their probation period and are in a mass shortage.
So all 50 of those fired and the others being investigated are all non-white diversity hires that weren’t qualified? Interesting take…if true it will bear out when the racial discrimination lawsuits start popping up.
These airlines dont care about the employees and always doing shady things they shouldn’t. Their operations have been a disaster post pandemic and now theyre blaming it out the employees. Shame on them. They take advantage of the employees
I am a retired flight attendant of 35 years. I was on reserve for a total of 8 years and understood the rules. I lived accordingly. I loved my job and truly enjoyed the best CAREER ever. It’s just so unfortunate these flights attendants do not care and therefore should leave the company. They will never have a better CAREER.
Unfortunately, Gail, most Flight Attendant over the last couple decades have not had enjoyed your experience. I began my F/A career in 1990, was on reserve 9 years straight before going to a different major airline where I was still on reserve after 22 years! I suffered that horrible indignity for over 30 years! As you know, it’s all about timing in this business. Anyone who started their career in 1980’s or earlier, usually has the career you describe. Sadly, it just isn’t that way anymore. (See my comments above which describe a little of what being on reserve is like.)
As a Flight Attendant of many years, reserve Flight Attendants do get the same base salary as everyone based on hours but the pay pr hour is different based on the number of hours we fly and the years of service.
I don’t care about your race, age or sex but I Do care about the people I work with being responsible to their company, passengers and fellow Flight Attendants. our reserves are a very important part of delivering the excellent service our passengers expect. and deserve.
when the company is short Flight Attendants it impacts all of us on the flight.
The FAA requires a certain number of Flight Attendants based on the number of passengers and the plane cannot take off without all of them
I personally think 5 weeks of school by the hiring airline should give you an idea of the requirements, don’t take the job if you don’t like the requirements . My union represents only Flight Attendants of that Airline and the union representatives are from that Airline. We vote on our contracts and it’s just like other elections, your vote is your voice. Use it or don’t bitch about what you get.
I expect the people I work with to present a professional appearance too.
You might be slightly uncomfortable if the pilot presented themself in the cockpit door with an unclean appearance. Appearance conveys
a lot about the profession, and professionalism, whatever it is.
American is totally within the right to terminate especially after a warning letter. They ability to rely on employee attendance is paramount to ANY companies survival. That’s the reality.
Fight attendants who work a flight DONT get paid while boarding passengers but the reserves get full time pay?
No no, Julie. None of us get paid for boarding or deplaning. I am on Reserve this month. We only get paid after the door is closed and the breaks are released.
None of us get paid for boarding, nor deplaning. The reserves get paid certain amount of hours minimum guaranteed per month.
Within the last week a couple of US carriers have said they would pay the FA half time the moment boarding begins. Major scare!!!
Sorry, last line should say major SCORE for the FA crew.
No where does it say, “reserve flight attendants get paid their full wage while on reserve, or what I’m assuming you meant, “on-call.””
Usually – flight attendants will receive a lesser amount for on-call pay.
They get partial pay for oncall and layovers, which is usually just a few dollars an hour.
Yes this is obserdly wrong that flight attendants are not paid until the crosscheck doors are locked. The amount of time we spent last week on april 21st on the tarmac 1.5 hours on a delay after delay for various reasons, and those poor FA got nada. On another note why don’t FAs get tips, like other customer services? Union’s are doing a diservice to FAs by not forcing airlines to cough up full pay for evert minute of time worked.
I do not know this for sure but I know in a different career field when I was on call I was only paid a couple dollars per hour to be on call much less than full-time pay. And then I receive double pay or time and a half when I was actually called in during that Reserve time.
That I’m aware of, most flight crew (pilots included), get paid for flight time – when the planes parking brake is released on departure, until it is set again on arrival. Hourly rates reflect this, and are not comparable to non-fligjt crew.
Reserve crew get paid a minimum number of hours (the amount is contractual) for a month, and if they fly past this, get paid for the extra.
I will say, “reserves” in NY and LA are challenged on many levels – most new hires cannot afford to live in these areas, so they “commute” and while on reserve, live 4-8 to a room in a shared “crash pad” apartment. They also must have their own way to cover the “co-bases”, meaning an expensive Uber when getting the occasional trip out of a co-base that is 60 miles away.
There’s something very wrong with a system that delays paying flight attendants for the work they do prior to the cabin doors being closed. I’m thinking of the FAs that I’ve seen walking through countless cabins guiding passengers to their seats assisting them with getting bags into the overhead. The pay period for flight attendants should begin the moment that they board the aircraft and end when the attendant exits the aircraft.
I agree! I didn’t realize that their pay period is based on the parking brake! Who dictated or negotiated that stipulation??? Flight attendants are also safety officers while we are on the aircraft with them! They deserve respect, respect that is reflected in the pay schedule! I’m appalled at the brake off to brake on nonsense!!!
Ok, off topic, but it’s been brought up….Not getting paid while you’re working getting people onto or off of the plane is a absolutely ridiculous!! Why in the world do your unions allow this absurdity?!?
The reserve system at American Airlines is horrible if you compare it to United and Delta. The APFA knows this, but can’t seem to do anything about it. The RAPs and rotation are touching flight attendants with more than thirty-five years seniority. It’s draconian.
If any flight attendants is on call 24-7 they should be paid for it…
Broke the company’s protocol got fired,,,!!! Even employee did not like the rule. Simple as that
The Flight Attendants Union is a joke…plain and simple. They do NOTHING in support of the flight attendants, but they’ll make sure they tell everyone how important they are. The abuse they’ve received and the Union takes a big fat dump on them constantly. Anyone associated with those people should be ashamed of themselves, but make sure your dues are paid.
I don’t know why the comments on this article turned into a racial debate. Let’s stay on track. These flight attendants are being paid for being on call. These flight attendants agreed to this condition for employment or they would not have been hired. If you are not going to abide by the conditions of your employment then you have to go. Its that simple. It doesn’t matter what color you are if your not doing your job your going to get fired.
Agree. When first started we HAD NO flight privileges for 6 months and reserve was 24/7. These people have no idea how brutal it was. At 31 years I’m falling back on reserve 1 or 2 times a year. This job requires a huge commitment. I love it.
What’s surprising to me is that given the reserve status one assumes these are pretty junior FA’s. Clearly there is a failure at all levels in hiring and training. If this is so widespread perhaps AA needs to look at who they are hiring and the culture they are building during training. This absolutely may be part of the issue in why AA FA’s are often so awful (not all). The culture is built top down and clearly it’s failing.
A big reason for this is that a number of junior crew are “commuters” so they don’t actually live full-time in the cities that they are assigned bases. Many of them do not have the resources or willingness to relocate, so instead choose to take their chances with space-available travel to and from their base cities. Of course, reserves tend to be required only when things go wrong – and when things go wrong there is a higher likelihood of them being out of position as a result. This could be resolved by the airline providing accommodation for them at their base while on reserve, but that would increase the costs to company.
I get all of that. But interestingly you don’t see Starbucks Baristas commuting from different cities. They seem to do just fine and reliably come in to work every day with a smile.
If so highly competitive with applicants it seems requiring a domicile in the base assigned is not out of the question. At least until they make the cut for line assignments.
you don’t awe them giving 50 pilots the axe…when the living out of base/commuting situation is the same. Airlines treat flight attendants like dogs…and so do the passengers and it shows.
*see
Reserve pilots WANT to fly to move up.
Many reserve FAs have to have other jobs to pay bills.
These are not pilots. These are FA’s. And the vast minority treat FA’s like dogs. In fact, they are treated the same as they command. With respect and dignity. Like a Starbucks Barista who I smile at and banter with every morning. Get over yourself.
Right on. Ha ha….
Pilots are higher skilled and have a lot more on the line. Pilots can ride jump seat roo FA’s can’t. Let me be clearer FA’s can ride cabin jump seats not cockpit.
Stuart.
Pilots have lost a lot of respect too. A lot of people do not think being a pilot is what it used to be. You criticize a Starbucks employee and a flight attendant. I think you just might be a narcissistic personality.
Some of us were based where we live, but for example a lot of us were furloughed during pandemic and after being recalled, displaced to different bases. I just bought a place when I got recalled and I don’t want to move every year, so I am choosing to commute yes until I get my transfer
Yeah! AA had zero problems in 1967 when I flew for them! You were terminated when you got married , for God’s sake. Also scales often waiting when female crew boarded to prepare for flights. One 1# too heavy and off w/out pay until your weight was lost. Example / 5’6 ‘’= top weight, 115 #. Funny thing though, cockpit crew never had to “weigh in” !
They should bring those scales back. I prefer asian or european airlines over US airlines for that reason.
Let’s just be real! Traditionally flight attendants, men an women, are hired Partially because of their looks. Pilots are hired for their skills, not their looks. I am soooo sick of people trying to make EVERYTHING a comparison of equals. I’m sure the pilot could not be too fat to fit in the seat
Have you ever seen a barista save a customers life by doing CPR or leading people in a slide evacuation, or getting punched by a drunk for getting a latte order wrong?? Two different jobs, only ONE of which has potentially life saving implications. Apple, meet orange. Someone skipped school the day they taught noun differentiation.
BRAVO!! I flew for 35 years for AA….and commuted to base for 90% of my career. Yes, even while on reserve. It can be done with the help of crash pads, family & friends to stay with, and flying in the night before you go ‘on call’.
However, I flew from 1979-2013, when housing was a hell-of a lot cheaper than it is now. Today, the average seniority of reserve F/A’s at AA is 12.5 years, not six months! That means a lot of F/A’s live outside of their home base due to marriage, children, taking care of elderly parents and a myriad of reasons.
No, I do not condone those who simply refuse to answer the phone or call out sick once assigned a trip.
I do however, have a problem with the double standard that is in place for pilots!!!
Pilots, can REFUSE an assignment at AA if there is at least one pilot junior to them in their rotation, WITHOUT the company retaliating in a punitive manner. Pilots are treated like adult human beings at AA.
Not so much are the F/A’s.
As to the author of this article……You really need to stop scrapping the bottom for ideas to make your deadlines. I find it ridiculous that you feel the need to report on the inner workings of the Airline industry, particularly zeroing in on F/A’s, whenever you get a wild hair up your butt, or are desperate for “clicks”.
Live & Lets Fly?!?!??? Hmmmm…… More like, Scorned & Bitter!
I don’t expect this reply to see daylight for long…if at all.
The point was if a barista can live in base why can’t an FA. Surely the FA makes a higher wage. Had nothing to do with job description. Looks like you skipped school the day they taught similes!
That’s a great point and something they could likely afford. But nope, just blame the crew and get the axe out. If they’re not in base-I get it- both sides must be accountable to the contract agreed upon. But there’s so many ways to ameliorate issues like this-even x amount of positive space to big reserve spots could do it and cost less than accommodation.
Flight attendants are not there to help with bags as a primary duty. Certainlu not lifting them anyway. It’s in there contract that they don’t lift passenger bags. Now some flight attendants may do it but they are actually going against what is in their contract. It’s in their to protect them because we would have more FA’s out legitimately due to back injuries.
And they are there for your safety. They get trained many hours on how to keep you safe. Hopefully you will never have a flight where you need them to really put it to use.
I’m a gate agents and I’ve got my complaints about FA’s but this comment is so condescending and dissmisive.
Training is where it all starts. If the CEO is not into training ppl with the best interests of the public in mind then you get bad crew. It does start at the VERY top of any company. The entire company of mgmt, trainers, crew, support staff etc must have the same prioritys in mind as 1. Once you have deviation from the common goal, turnover is evident. The work ethic today of youth is very questionable but that’s a family problem. Nobody can work like the person next to them, but they can be taught how to work together for the common good of the public. Crews work with together with ppl of various backgrounds, race, religions, political beliefs etc. it’s common knowledge. Once the uniform is put on, crewn crew thinks the same as 1.
i probably would have docked pay or given them disciplinary days off before firing. But they all were warned, they all understood the rules. But maybe i’m a softee.
Screw airlines management. Their incompetence gets them a bailout. And we are screwing junior employees?
Good job fight attendants. You made money while doing nothing. That is what is capitalism. Increase revenue, and control cost. That is what you did for personal Inc
Ultimately anything that results in a delay or cancellation is a huge inconvenience to paying customers. That should be first in these FAs minds if they truly want to provide great service. Obviously not the case with these 50 fires ones and for that good riddance.
Let’s be real. The FAs are there to work and make a living. Not to make life convenient for customers. They’re not Mother Theresa. That’s the business of the airlines. Sure, it’s a requisite of the job, but not their ultimate goal, and we should stop expecting that. These are human beings with their own needs and circumstances. Perhaps we should consider, with the number of people not meeting the requirements of the job, that it’s the requirements of the job that need to be revisited and changed and not the employees.
Let’s be real. Everyone’s purpose at a job is to make a living (earn money) but is that where we stop? No! Do we not want doctors that have a good bedside manor? Are skilled at what they do? Or should we just promote butchers to Dr status because they simply want to “work and make a living”? That is an absurd thing to say. I may feel like calling people names, but I won’t do that unless I feel like getting fired. Put your best foot forward is expect to be terminated. Pretty much every job is to provide the best service to the customer, who ever that customer is. For fa that customer is people taking flights.
AA does rotating reserve and in Clt Dfw Phx many 35 year f a s are on reserve while 2 and 3 year f a s have a line . United doesn’t do this and they have a reliable operation . AA caters to new employees and the senior ones call off sick and the airline pays double triple time to get people to show up. Poor management and a sexist company.
What’s fascinating with all of this is the fact that both the union and its members are failing to mention that American Airlines tried to fire a few Flight attendants in 2018 for this same act ,the union brought this matter to court and the arbitration ruled in the unions favor ,stating that as long as the FA makes their assignments they’re not committing any punishable acts .Some how the union now has sided with the company and allowing these offenses ti continue (no surprise here )
Also, they’re not treating reserves for last minute call outs or irregularities in day to day flying ,they are literally flying reserves every single day they are available,reserves now are flying more than most line holders as the company literally creates trips just to assign them to reserves
Zero excuse for these FAs. They are being PAID on reserve and are contractually obligated to be there. Your argument doesn’t hold water.
Exactly! Everyone has an opinion and really don’t know the inner operations of the business. I too am a flight attendant. I’m hold a line but while on reserve, I had to SACRIFICE to be where I needed to be, period! I’ve seen it time and time again where a FA, that really only wants the perks, calls sick and then take another flight with a different airline to Barbados and get their stupid, naive selves on Facebook posting their selfies, knowing good and damn well they were on call. That’s why AA is going above and beyond with their investigations….
Union no longer represents FAs. Did you know the Union Leaders get FREE lifetime confirmed flight passes? Not even employees or retirees get this
Union leaders would be employees right?
The problem is that the flight attendants who have been fired are NOT making their flights. They are sitting at home (out of base), getting paid, and hoping not to get used. Then when crew scheduling calls them with a trip they say they are sick. That’s why they’re getting fired. They’re stealing from the company.
You’re getting used every day you are on reserve. There’s no such a thing as not getting used
If you don’t go into work, you are not getting used.
As a former airline flight attendant, It is about time American and any other airline that has experienced this, take action on behalf of their organization and the flying public. I was caught up in this quagmire just moments before we were to board! As a result, over 100 customers were sent off to another line to rebook their flight. All the while, they were short a flight attendant. Being that it was the end of the day when few flights were available, so many people were left stranded. I opted to wait till a replacement had arrived; they had the audacity to joke about it on the flight. Needless to say no one laughed and most were fuming. How thoughtless and inconsiderate to all those paying customers. The airline has some culpability and is responsible for making sure that its operations is accountable. When I arrived at my destination, the same quagmire had occurred there! Good riddance to all entitled slackers you deserve to be fired! Thanks American for finally doing the right thing.
There is a lack of professionalism in a significant number of flight attendants, unfortunately. It can be hard to find good employees. In contrast, there is much more professionalism among pediatricians (who are doctors), who sometimes don’t earn very much.
Derek, are you kidding?! Pediatricians make upwards of 130,000 annually. That’s well over flight attendant pay. There are also plenty of rude and entitled doctors.
Pediatricians make half that, despite the years of med school.
There is not a pediatrician in the U.S. who would work for 65k a year. Where do people come up with this crap?
Yep half the people commenting on here are not Americans. It shows on how they hold FA positions in high esteem. I don’t know anyone who goes to medical school and don’t make over $200,000 in the us. Nurses in some cases make more than that.
These junior FAs took a gamble on being needed for a flight… and lost. But I also agree that the culture at AA needs an overhaul. The attitudes and morale of AA FAs are among the worst.
Failing leadership results in low morale rank and file members
Took the words right out of my mouth. The main issue comes from the top and trickles down to what Customers see day to day.
Took the words right out of my mouth. The main issue comes from the top and trickles down
I was a Flight Attendant. And was on reserve for MANY years. Some posters said rents were too high. Well we got a “crash pad”…6 or 8 flight attendants paid a small amount each month. If you had an early “reserve call” you commuted the night BEFORE to the crash pad…So that you were in fact ready for work if called. This is a no-brainer. But today’s young people do not have that responsibility built into their DNA. They deserve to be fired. Too bad,so sad.
I also was a FA. I had to live no more than 20 minutes from the airport and routinely would get calls in the middle of the night to cover flights. There’s nothing worse than getting a phone call at 2 am and told your flight leaves in one hour. One time I got to my flight which was completely boarded and couldn’t take off until I arrived. I did my walk of shame down the aisle to the back of the a/c with everyone staring at me (it wasn’t my fault!). I was flying with 3 male f/a and one looked at me and said, “Girlfriend, go in the bathroom, lock the door, and don’t come out until you put a face on and fix your hair”. Ahhh, the joy and fun of being on reserve!
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@Sunny, I was impressed with your straight-forward, no-nonsense experience. I was in the same boat as a new-hire pilot for a major in the mid-80s. The crash pad was the place to pre-position yourself the night before going onto Reserve status or reporting for your early-morning scheduled trip. We all did it, and no one complained, least of all our passengers whom we delivered to their destinations on time for the price of their ticket, which was paying our salaries. One thing not mentioned in the article or in most comments was the importance of a good attitude toward your job, which starts with respect for yourself and personal responsibility. I bet you had a great time, as did I!
Aaron is not only the attitudes and morale of FA, is from Ticket Agents all the way down to Rampers this is the culture USAir brought to AMERICAN AIRLINES once a First Class airline.
This has gone on way too long. Good for AA.
Help me out…are “junior” flight attendants (those being fired) all younger (age) at AA? Do these “junior” flight attendants receive lower wages and have found out the wages suck and don’t fit the job? Maybe, they heard Delta is gonna start paying (50% wages) for their time when boarding a plane..and, I’m sure, when they deplane passengers at their destination? Those are my inquiries for the author.
Junior only by seniority. Some are young, some are “old” in terms of age.
Junior does not equal young. You can be 30, or 50 and be junior.
There are too many problems with the reserve system as a whole to even think you can find an answer or determine AA was right or wrong. We’re those fa abusing the system? Probably. Only they know. Was AA right by firing them? Probably, but the problem will not go away until the whole system is modified and it’s made more human. One thing is for sure, when they hire you they make sure they hide the horrific side of reserve. Trust me. You have no idea what’s in store for you until it’s too late, and they pay, well below poverty line. A good amount af new hires quit during the first year because you can afford it. I was in my 40’s and in reserve with a family and I had to sleep in ops bc I couldn’t affirmation crash pad until they took that away.
The company is at fault just as much as the FA’s.
I’m not justifying not doing your job, god knows I did. But the system is inhumane at times and management does nothing to change it. The whole concept of reserve ahold be reviewed. The issue has been in place since ever! I don’t know one single ga that says oh yes! Reserve was the best!!
Why can we reverse the concepts? Make reserve attractive for FA’s.
When we choose to do this job, we did because we like to fly!
Ugh. I was just at the face-to-face interview with AA a couple months back. They SPECIFICALLY said: “while you are junior and on reserve, we DO NOT recommend commuting. We strongly advise relocating to your assigned base.” I went into the interview prepared to do just that. I didn’t get the job. This is so frustrating to see, but not unheard of. Oh well!
I also went through three interviews and was not accepted. I’m a great employee and very well qualified. I also find this very frustrating to read.
People didn’t do their job and got fired. Why is this an article? First year flight attendant retention has always been low. In part because of reserve lines, in part because new hires aren’t aware of how grueling the job can be. More than half my class didn’t make it off reserve and that was in the early 2000’s.
Good for AA. If people don’t show up for work (apparently because they’re on vacation somewhere they flew for free using their travel benefits), fire them. I’m pretty sure that’s how all jobs work. If you are senior and you don’t show up for work, they fire you, too. When you interview for the job, they warn you not to commute on reserve. You do what everyone has done for decades and move into a tiny apartment with 4-12 of your favorite classmates somewhere close to your base. They explain all this in the interviews and during training.
Also, reserves aren’t always that junior. I spent years on straight reserve, and even with nearly 30 years seniority occasionally go on and off reserve, the last time being in 2021.
I would be surprised at that…It is tough for “revenue” standbys to get on a flight…flights seem to be all full these days… I would think a tough benefit to achieve these days with travel capacity high.
These articles popped up as well…maybe because of reading a similar topic(?)
I am sure there are many facets to this story.
https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/price-of-paradise/homelessness-in-florida-becoming-a-middle-class-problem
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/florida-housing-least-affordable-in-the-u-s-miami-tampa-orlando-naples/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thrillist.com/amphtml/news/nation/delta-flight-attendants-first-paid-during-boarding
The problem at American Airlines is that they are failing to correct a bad reserve system. Flight attendants are serving reserve at 35 years seniority. Flight attendants that have worked 35 years have earned enough sick time to use it when they want. How are flught attendants suppose to know they will be sick the next day? Hasn’t anyone gone to bed feeling fine and wake up sick? Now flight attendants are suppose to predict the future. The person who wrote this article needs to do more research.
Yes, there is a definite responsibility…just thinking, you have to wonder why…sad
I don’t agree with America West as much as the next person but they are in the right here.
When they were hired they agreed to this work! 100 %…now after being hired, they want to change the rules! Happens all the time. Sorry, this is what they agreed to, they were not promised regular flights when they were interviewed.
I agree on there is an issue. I do feel in seeing these articles also in the news, it is multifaceted, with a few issues & hopefully promising solutions. Futures are at stake.
Topping the list, unaffordable housing across the nation…ironic these articles popped up in my newsfeed.
Tried to post before hopefully not a duplicate.
https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/price-of-paradise/homelessness-in-florida-becoming-a-middle-class-problem
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/florida-housing-least-affordable-in-the-u-s-miami-tampa-orlando-naples/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thrillist.com/amphtml/news/nation/delta-flight-attendants-first-paid-during-boarding
Hmmm, maybe if AA went back to pre-deregulation FA staffing levels there wouldn’t be so many cancelled flights due to reserves not showing up. How about adding 4 to 8 more FAs in first and business with another 6 to 12 additional FAs in coach/economy/steerage/peasant class? That’s about 21 more FAs per twin aisle wide body. Service should be slightly quicker and more personal even if 2 FAs don’t show up. Yes, I am a wild eyed dreamer, who believes that all passengers should get 27 inch wide seats with two wide individual armrests and 42 inches of seat pitch. I dream of double or triple the number FAs that the FAA says is the minimum acceptable. I dream of unlimited really high quality non-alcoholic beverages made without high fructose corn syrup. I dream of a 2 bag checked luggage allowance for all passengers.
Mr. Hoffman, I think this perspective may be on to something. If you are operating a bare bones operation & weather, mechanicals, covid, or other emergencies come in, then that results in chaos.
You have to wonder why American is the only one in the news for this?
It is not something I would want promoted, even if stating a strong stance… The reflection on the situation doesn’t seem right.
Remember when there was lobster & caviar service elements & not just mass transportation.
Exactly! Like my grandma would say You can’t ask for pears from a peach tree. (I know there is an actual saying in English for that translation)
Aside from the fact that newer generations are not willing to work as hard or take the abuses as quietly as older generations have is besides the point. The firing is just a quick fix for a symptom! Find the root of the problem. The reserve system as it is it’s faulty and the cycle will not change until it is reformed.
2 hours is a little tight, in my opinion. Maybe 4 hours is more realistic., especially since airports are in big cities and it takes at least a half hour to an hour, minimum to get ready. Perhaps they would have less call outs as I’m sure sometimes people just can’t make it.
Two hour window to find adequate staffing for a flight may seem “tight” for some — unless you’re a passenger on THAT flight who wonders why the carrier couldn’t muster a complete crew to work the flight on time. Very few people allow an airline to slide on situations like this.
I’d encourage everyone who said these 50 employees got what they deserved take a moment to pause and imagine getting hired at the job you applied for, in the city you applied for it in, then being furloughed and finding out you may not have a job in the very near future. You stayed and worked through the most dangerous part of the pandemic, coming into direct contact with literally thousands of passengers, nearly 8,000 touch points per day. Meanwhile, your most senior coworkers took paid leaves of absence all while making close to double your wage. Your bills don’t disappear just because your job did. Then, imagine that they invite you back after several months with/without pay, depending on your years of service, only to find out you have been displaced to another base. How do you just walk away from your house, family, relationships and start over in a new base that’s way more expensive to live in? Some perspective and maybe just a little compassion are in order here.
That you will be posted to a base away from your home city was known when they accepted the offer.
Plenty of doctors, nurses, pilots, soldiers, tradesman worked on these and worse terms over the last 2 years. In factct over the last 100 years or so. They kept their end of the bargain. Pandemic or not.
What’s special about AA FAs?
If you reneg, the airline renegs too.
Sorry, not sorry.
For the record, the senior flight attendants who took a leave of absence did NOT get paid. Far from it, they attempted to collect unemployment from states like California who were completely inundated with a deluge of claims
I fired American Airlines long ago for not getting me to any of my destinations on time or even at all. Haven’t looked back since.
When I started flying we had to be 55 minutes from the airport if you were reserve I would never ever even think about not making a trip if called If you don’t like the rules then quit as there are many out there who would love the privilege of being hired as flight attendants
Maybe they would prefer not to be genocided.
The young often behave as entitled, and meltdown like the snowflakes that they are when their wokeful arrogance no longer shields then from good ol’ fashioned accountability.
One speech that isn’t clearly being explained here is that flight attendants and pilots often do not reside where they are based. Many of them choose to live in lower cost cities than those major cities where they are assigned to begin their trip.
The argument is this the airline allows for this. Majority of flight attendants and pilots commute to work and either stay in hotels, share Crashpads, and very often just sleep in the airport inside the crew lounge between trips. Reserve flight attendants can’t afford to stay at these base cities so they commute home and hope they won’t get called out. When they do get that call, they call in sick since they can’t catch a flight and be there in time.
So here lies the problem. Hire a crew member that can’t afford to live in a base city like LA, Chicago, Miami, NYC, etc on a starting pay on $21k/year and allow them to commute to their home, or only hire people who already live in these cities and can afford the cost of living there.
Agreed!
A recurring theme in any story about union contracts is a vast disparity in benefits and quality of life based on seniority. Senior union members love the perks, power, and stability. Corporations love the opportunity to turn union members against each other and weaken the union. Junior union members just hope tolerate the system long enough to become senior members .
Too bad they don’t hire for Weekend FAs!
I and others would definitely train and be available on Friday Afternoons into Sunday Nights.
They need to think flexibly because the pandemic broke the standard mold.
I feel so bad when people are called to report on their duty and they fail to do so unlike here in Kenya we’re looking for jobs or someone organizations that can train or hire us.
When signing in a contract, you must have gone through it and read it properly over and over in order to avoid such silly and cheap mistakes. Well done to that organization for taking that quick actions so that next time they won’t get a chance to sleep on their job
TWA had perfect attendance bonuses and holiday pay, as well as adhering to a first-in first-out rota and being transparent about where you were on the list. AA did not and seemed to actively target those out of range, easier to do by the area code of their contact number back when few had cell phones.
I was a flight attendant for TWA from 1970 until 2001. When I had perfect attendance, I don’t recall receiving a bonus. I received a perfect attendance pin. During my long career, I flew many holidays and did not get holiday pay. I was on reserve for a few months in 1970 and only had 5 days free of duty per month.
As a former Airline Manager responsible for 300+ flight attendants, I applaud any airline for even being able to fire 1 misbehaving employee. I had a flight attendant sleeping on the job i couldnt get rid of. The unions make it practically impossible to discipline workers, and the flights will not run without them. No wonder AA is starting to run busses instead of shorter flights- super-costly staff can’t even be bothered to show up. Don’t take the job if you don’t want it.
It seems the author needs an on-call editor to catch grammar and spelling errors.
I’m not sure who your inside resource is, but evidently you do not work for the airline, yet you find it within your right to provide the public with half-truths and false information, adding your opinion on top of it. Trash journalism at its finest. Bravo for making flight attendants look like the bad guys AGAIN after all of the abuse we received the last 2 years, not only from passengers but the companies we work for as well. FYI if flight attendants were paid the minimum livable wage for the base they are assigned to, most of us wouldn’t have to commute. Fact: it is not only the “juniors” having issues, as “seniors” actively commute as well and are also subject to reserve. It’s rather convenient that you claim to know so much about the company and its flight attendants, yet you failed to utter a word about the negative effects furlough had on employees. Flight attendants were stripped of their livelihood with no return date in sight. Seniors had to fly their butts off due to staff shortages. A lot of flight attendants had to move back in with family members-all in different parts of the country-simply to try to survive. After 6-9 months (depending on seniority) of unemployment, flight attendants were finally welcomed back to the line, but a vast majority were displaced from their original base; therfore the few who didn’t have to move in with family over furlough still were forced into commuting to a different base other than the one they were residing in. Still recovering from the pandemic, airline routes had been cut significantly, making it even more challenging to get to work. Let’s not forget all the planes that had been sitting for months on end without use and all of the mechanical troubles brought with it, canceling flights left and right for months. Also, pilots, flight attendants, gate agents, and mechanics alike are burnt out from irregular operations, reassignments that continuously violate our contract and legalities, yet we’re expected to show up and plaster a smile on our face for ignorant, ungrateful passengers who think they’re entitled to speaking about my profession without ever having lived it? I think not. Mind your business and quit creating a false narrative about mine.
Paragraph breaks are a thing. Learn to use them. No one is going to read your shrill comment (I know it’s shrill and whiny because I skimmed it, but the lack of paragraph breaks hurt my eyes).
The irate guy is doing it wrong. You’re not supposed to say homophobia or racism (or what have you) made you misbehave—you are supposed to blame it on some external factor. Like the time a high school announcer used racial slurs during a broadcast and later claimed that his diabetes and high blood sugar made him use the slurs. That’s how it’s done.
The world was furloughed, airline employees did not corner the market on no pay am I still going to have a job and I need to move back home. Get a grip they violated their contract and they think using the I’m offended card entitles them too no consequences.
I sat reserve duty for many years for American Airlines. At the time there were no cell phones and beepers were just coming out. I can remember a particular early summer evening when all my friends were going out but I had to stay in my apartment alone and lonely as crew schedule would not release me for a few hours. Years later as I gained seniority, I was able to fly the best trips we had on a regular schedule. That was the job. I was delighted to fly for American for 32 years.
I have many family members in the transportation industry unions. It seems the attitude toward rendering a honest days work is becoming more and more poisoned. And to be fair management seems to have developed poorer means to run operations. Volume and technology have contributed to the increase in demands for faster resolution to operational problems. And of course the ancient problems of lordship. Workers and owners and inbetweeners. But stop for one minute and wonder. How would this all play out in a society that will exchange our bill of rights for a fast and heavy handed government to iron out problems? Keeping our Constitution will mean being patient and only God knows where that comes from.
The contract says what the contract says. Good for American. The real problem is that many flight attendants (with the Union’s help) have convinced themselves that they “are there primarily for our safety” and treat the service aspects of the job with disdain. Clearly, since they serve drinks and help with bags on every single flight and serious safety incidents are extremely rare, they are not there primarily for our safety. They are there primarily to serve drinks and help with bags. Let’s just be real about it. So the sooner they stop telling themselves, and us us, that they are NOT stewards/ stewardesses the better. Then this indignation can end and they can stop being so angry.
Ive been on flights where I ended up having a medical emergency or where someone has gotten beligerent and needed to be restrained and removed from the flight by police. The most important part of a flight attendant’s job is the health and safety of everyone and it always has been. A flight attendant saved my grandmother’s life in 1990 and gave us another 8 years with her when she had a stroke on a flight. I would much rather they ignore the drinks service and focus on safety, no one will die from getting slow airplane food sevice but they can if flight attendants dont focus on safety above everything else.
To all Flight Attendants: I just wanted to say Thank You for all that you do. You are “parents” to kids traveling alone, “nurses” to those who are ill and shouldn’t be flying, “host” to all passengers rude and kind. You are the emergency responders in the air. And you all are taken for granted for everything you are called to do once we are 30,000 feet in the air. And you did it all in heels, dress shoes, a skirt, a suit, in probably the most uncomfortable attire ever!!
I have traveled for many years and long distances. No matter how tired, exhausting, or stretched thin your crew is, you always put on a smile, talk with eloquence, and move with grace. The airlines would not be who it is without you. You are literally the essence of the airlines. You are who we remember when we deboard and go home.
I didnt know you only got paid once the door closed. So the hellos, may I help you find your seat, helping passengers put baggage away, getting drinks was all on “personal” time?!?? I always thought you were paid the minute you reported for duty. I pray that your union negotiates a contract where you are paid the minute you step foot on the plane!
But from a long time frequent flyer, I just wanted to say THANK YOU!!!! I APPRECIATE YOU AND ALL THAT YOU DO! ❤️
Love it, love it. You nailed it right on the head I so agree with American finally doing what should have been done long time ago. 100% my support
As a retired AA pilot, I was paid when the brakes were released. Yes, there was duty hour pay, but check-in was on us so to speak. We also were not paid when we walked on the airplane. I guess some of the wokettes out there will complain about anything.
I fly a lot on various airlines. I have had rude flight attendants that were white. Rude flight attendants that were black. I have had rude flight attendants that were Asian. I have also had stellar, professional, attentive flight attendants that were black, white, Asian and other nationalities that I can’t identify or remember. I think it simply boils down to this . . If the airlines – or any other company- place higher priority when hiring someone based on race, age or gender instead of ability, work ethic and commitment to one’s job, this will continue to be an ongoing problem. The pay is what the pay is. They knew this going in. The work expectations have not changed per the contract. I support AAs decision. Other companies will need to start making similarly hard decisions like this is they expect positive customer interaction.
This is the hate that is slowly but surely destroying us all.
Referring to Fab’s and Hunter’s and many others woke comments. Anyone who calls another a racist are they themselves a racist, you can tell this by their hateful comments about Michelle. I have been working for a major airline for over 25 years and have seen all of the changes, and in the last 2 plus years, not for the better. Michelle’s comments were spot on. I actually see who they hire and their work ethic. Our airline went woke too and the new hires drop like flies as soon as they are junior assigned. The airlines are desperate to hire anyone to be politically correct. It’s not about quality, it’s all about diversity. And it’s a bunch of BS about the airlines only hiring white people because if that were the case, I would never have been hired. Next time you fly look around you, see who they have actually hired, This has nothing to do with race, gender or sexual preference. Get over it.
Quite right the flight attendants were given the boot. It’s time people started adhering to company rules and regulations.
So everyone is upset because somebody pointed out that diversity is a one of the top factors for employment? I’d say meeting diversity quotas might even look more favorable than job experience itself. Optics is a huge deal for companies. They want their company to look like they represent everyone. Am I living in the Twilight zone where folks are in denial? Didn’t we hear the public over and over again say that the government elections were too white and male? That they wanted more representation? But apparently it’s a stretch to think that other career sectors are looking to hire many demographics as well? On the one hand, I think it’s important for minorities and underprivileged groups to have opportunities. But on the other hand, it really undermines their talent, hardwork, ect. if employers don’t care about those accomplishments. Just imagine how uncomfortable it is to have a stellar resume, but all the boss what’s to do is check off the fact that you’re a minority. Cringe! You’d definitely want your work history and talent to be acknowledged. Not saying every employer is like that, but there definitely are ones out there that just wanna look good by hiring someone from every sexuality, ethnicity, sex, ect.
Quality of somebody’s work is so much more important than what you look like.
It’s called buyers remorse. Some young people get a FA job because of the flight privileges but after seeing all the stuff you have to do they want out. It’s a hard job being on called with half pay and not being able to get another job especially if you live in an expensive city with no one to help pay the bills. They probably don’t want the job anymore and praying AA would fire them so they can get unemployment. Postal service have something similar, actually it’s way worse, you on called 24 hours without pay and cannot get another job. You can’t even go to school part time with this job only retirees are people who don’t have to work should be doing this Unthankful job. People living outside the US think it’s a great job but if you American it’s worst than a called center job. Any job that you jump when the phone rings, tell you can’t drink and have a good time, you can’t go to school, you can’t plan for anything is not going to work out for most young persons. The people on here commenting are not in their age group.
Koffee you are right on. That is the exact reason why they shouldn’t have taken the job in the first place. They wasted their time and AA’s money training them. Good luck finding a job that fits their Schedule and pays them big bucks.
If you take offense to something in your contract don’t take the job sit home in mommies basement hugging a puppy and playing with crayons. Talk about an entitled idiot generation, Gen I.
Airlines are hiring diverse groups and the OP was not being racist. It is the truth, as companies proudly admit that they are a diverse company. (What ever that means). They are also hiring now based on what the general public look like, as opposed to decades ago. Reserve FAs can be with a company for many years, and decades.However, as I have been a FA for decades the type they are hiring now does have a different belief system. (Not all of them, but most). They think the company should acquiesce to them as individuals. They want the rules changed and if they are not, then they refuse to do what they are supposed to. The worst part is that companies do nothing to reprimand them. The unions give lots of rewards to the slackers and nothing for the good workers. The whole work ethic is upside down.
Well, being a very senior citizen who traveled frequently in my proffesion, I miss the “good old days” when the seats were much wider, the lines were much shorter, you actually got a pretty good meal in coach, and most of the staff were young, attractive, friendly and polite. Now you are packed in like sardines, you get a bag of peanuts, and your attendant may be a fat homely middle aged man. Or worse. Haha. I used to fly to/from all the major airports on all the major airlines. No long lines at security checks. If you were able to return earlier than expected you could use the same ticket to catch an earlier flight on a different airline. It was actually fun to fly back then. Now I own a luxury RV and travel in comfort and seldom fly anymore. Being retired has its advantages!
to: anyone in commercial aviation on the front lines
from: orphans of apollo
deregulation in ’78 created a broken industry with broken companies that were destroyed by greedy idiots in the 80s and 90s, and the insanity of the industry is frozen in (de)-regulatory (lobbiest-paid) deep capture.
today’s management has zero connection to the pioneers that created the industry and the titans that took it global. they are enriched by the race to the bottom, and you, on the front lines, are collateral damage.
come to terms with it or gtfo.
consider the suffering of the front lines of the medical industry for the past 2 years, the millions of people whose lives were economically destroyed in March and April of 2020, and the families of the dead, regardless of their politics…… and stop bitching.
rent a crappy apartment 100 miles away from your base airport and shut the fork up, or get out of the industry.
it takes a decade to earn your stripes, hold the good lines, and make enough money to live “where you want”.
finally, reduced frequency / irrops ARE NOT support for your problem, it’s prima facie evidence of the need for you to get a crappy apartment 100 miles from your base and earn your stars.
In a nutshell this is the problems in the workforce today. They want the benefits and not the responsibilities. I worked in a power plant for 40 years. They asked me pre hire if I would work the overtime and take my fair share of call outs. I agreed and held up my end of the deal. Some who came on board later not so much. That made it tougher on the rest of us.
I’m tired of hearing about all these silly “woke’ and LGB comments. It seems like there’s a certain group of people in this country who like to talk about woke, targeting Democrats, liberals, progressives, and blame every single thing that they don’t like in America on them. The big problem is that young people today don’t have the same work ethic as generations ago. Race and diversity issues are just a smoke screen for these 20 and 30 somethings who feel entitled and do not have to start at the bottom, work hard, and earn the job they have. A significant part of the problem in hiring when talking about diversity in airlines and other businesses is that people of color have been systematically discriminated against for many many years and there’s still fighting for their rights and respect for who they are and not what’s the color of their skin along the side of the white majority in this country.
It is “ cut throat business” you broke the protocol got fired. It is a cur throat business
I am a former AA flight attendant (class of 95-12). It blows my mind that these employees thought they could get away with these kinds of stunts. The 2 hour callout was strictly enforced even back then.
I was a commuter after my first year with the airline due to the fact the cost of living in NYC vs. a new hire B-Scale pay. For the following two years I had to fly in from MIA the night before if I was on reserve. I even carried with me an ID-90 pass just in case I had to fly on a different airline to get to work. It took 3 years before I was awarded my transfer to Miami. Anyone who tries to use their travel benefits while calling out sick SHOULD be terminated.
When you can’t attract and retain employees then you need to increase compensation and/or improve working conditions until you can. No one should have to put up with $21K a year and ridiculous schedules like that. This game can go on as long as these companies want! They’re in the driver’s seat and can decide to stop the madness and treat employees with an acceptable minimum level of respect and human decency.
I was wondering, reading this, why this article seemed so conspicuously biased in favor of the airline, choosing to simply accept its allegations at face value, assume scurrilous intent on behalf of flight crew, and not investigate the issue in any real depth, then I looked at the author…
An LA prettyboy who spends all his time flying as a customer or a “travel consultant” and clearly has never worked a service job in his life, eager to blame underpaid overworked flight crew for his cancellations and delays? Try working a real job for a day in your life before you suck this much corporate ****
You don’t need them anyway. The inbred/hybrid takeover of the planet created a planet of indigents. If you were going to offer food, you would have the loser go to the food counter section by section. Entitled lobotomized low life mandate has destroyed the planet.
Blaming the terminations on FA behaviors that occurred because of diversity in hiring is racist. It implies that diverse people can’t do the job. Blaming this on “woke” attitudes suggests that being woke is a bad thing, when the point of being woke is ending systemic racism and other forms of intolerance, such as ageism, misogyny, and homophobia. Reading the many vitriolic comments in this thread about diversity and being woke reflects the toxic cultural divisiveness that exists in the U.S. today. I support being woke and the cultural benefits of companies hiring employees who represent the diversity of our country. Those that assume that the 50 FA’s who were fired were “diverse” people with blue finger nail polish, and that they somehow had poor work ethics because of their diversity are revealing deeply intolerant and racist attitudes that are harming this country.
All you need to do to clarify this discussion is ….”look at the attendants when you get on a plane! They all are very young and very pretty! I have never seen one that was over weight, too short, or wearing unapproved clothing. I have never seen one attendant that was over 40. I have seen male attendants as well. Same profile! Nice looking, young, physically shaped and well groomed.
sooooooo. Think and make up your own mind!!
As a flight attendant of nearly 20 years I have to say Reserve is the worse situation you can find yourself in. I spend the first 10 years of my career on Straight Reserve! No even a slight chance I could hold a line. It took a BIG toll on my family. I aged considerably due to stress and the inhuman treatment from management and scheduling. I even commuted on reserve while on probation. A trifecta! BUT, despite it all, I made it.
I am 55 a different generation from what we see today in junior flight attendants. This generation finds fault for every little thing they don’t like or doesn’t suit their needs and they blame someone or something else. Are they right or wrong? Only time will tell. They are definitely more into what suits them and them only.
There is no such a thing as a post pandemic hiring or class (the first post pandemic class just graduated) and the reserve rules have not changed. Is just that they don’t want to be inconvenienced.
My question is can there be some kind of happy medium? Some kind of human solution they benefits both fa and company. Of course there is but the company culture has refused to change with the times, and either extreme is neither beneficial or conducive to a wholesome work environment.
The day we see kinder, more understanding management willing to take into consideration our families and our challenges in life, that’s the day we’ll turn the page and a better culture of taking care of the employees will be born.
There will always be that person that plays the system, but they be weed out soon enough. Being a fa now a days is not for the light hearted.
When management comes to the table willing to work outside the box and willing to try something new, that would be the day this always “us against them” culture will be left behind.
A whole different system has to be created. There are always fa that for some reason or another want to fly, even if it’s last minute.
I’m willing to bet that if more of our input is recognized with less harshness and imposed rules (hard 40, attendance policy) a system can be created that benefits both company and employee.
We are human beings, not numbers. Why can we both take a piece of the pie and be happy? You, the Customer is the ultimate beneficiary. Now, is that such a bad thing?????
Just rambling……
I will say this as a 36+ year flight attendant. Years ago when I was purser on a flight, one of our new flight attendants didn’t show up for briefing. My crew and I went to the plain thinking that he had perhaps gone directly there instead of the briefing room. He wasn’t on the plane. A supervisor showed up and asked me where this person was. I tried to cover for this person knowing that they were new. I asked the supervisor can’t you just give him a Mulligan? He’s brand new! She looked at me and she said “We’ve already given him several chances. Now I’m going to ask you this question; he’s brand new and he should be shining like a star but instead he is late for his check in and not onboard the plane minutes before boarding is to start. Do you wanna work with this person for the rest of your career? Do you want to be covering for this person for the rest of your career? Do you wanna go understaffed because this person didn’t show up on time to work the departure?” I will say at that point in time I looked at her and I said you have made very good points. No, I do not.
Every business needs dependable employees Every employee deserves dependable coworkers.
Did this James Heitkemper just say, and I quote, “It’s time for the 2nd revolutionary war for independence. I have a list of Democrats including the governor of my own state. Given the chance I will take them out.” ? And does any care he said it?
On my last American flight the flight attendant was so wide she had to walk down the aisle sideways. I kid you not. What happened to weight standards? Aesthetics aside, surely this is a safety issue?
Wow, it’s astonishing how many Americans are brain-washed with the pioneer spirit of do or die trying. We have a parallel in the UK, which Monty Python sent up beautifully in their “lick the road clean” sketch. No, no a thousand times no, it is NOT ok to be a minimum slave wage and suck it up like Lil orphan Annie. This does not a great nation make. It makes a nation of miserable, over-worked emotionally exhausted people. Ever wonder why there are so many homeless and people living in their cars – living in your car!!! – in the self professed richest country on Earth?
It’s beyond disgusting that anyone would be expected to work for $16k a year and then deal with you all in the air.
Did you know there are food banks in PHL for AA crew because that’s how little you and their company regard them. At least at Starbucks you tip your “Barista” – tell me the last time any of you knuckleheads did something nice for your FA.
Standards set by the airlines and agreed to by the unions need to be met by the employees. The flying public (ie: the people who ultimately pay the crews’ salaries) needs to be able to expect reliable service. This particularly holds true for business/elite-level fliers. Unfortunately, this problem exists across the industry. My wife and I had flight cancellations on 3 consecutive trips on another major, non-discount airline in the past month. Sitting on the phone for hours trying to rebook flights is a waste of time, and not good for one’s blood pressure.
On my20 or so segments this year I could easily give AA a list of fifty who should be let go. And 50 who should be promoted.
Matt you hit a nerve. Live and let’s rant!
The point that comes to mind is if you have all these complaints why not “just quit” and work somewhere else or start your own company. Every business has draw backs. Yes I am a frequent flyer with millions plus miles. Most of the FA’s seem burnt out because of the passengers. Investigate the company and the job before you sign on. I think both sides have problems. A key point I learned I learned years ago “what do you bring to the table”
All of these comments are ridiculous. You have been contracted and paid to do a job and you didn’t do it. You get fired. Period! It’s not about pharma, race, or anything but you were expected to do your job and and you didn’t do it. The title of the article was stupid. Ouch? Why is that an ouch? You signed up for the job and didn’t do it. A warning about not meeting the obligations of your contract by AA is not offensive. The company is paying you money to be on reserve and show up when required. This is business. Get a different job but don’t not show up for a job and then blame the company. It doesn’t matter how much you make. You are getting paid to do what you have been contacted to do and you didn’t do it. Your union should be trying to figure out why you think you don’t need to show up and still have a job.
Since we dont know the seniority of the flight attendants being fired lets not put it all on them being junior…I just started my 35 year with American and Im on reserve! So please until you jave all the facts….
The reserve program is a known fact of employment and acceptance of employment is acceptance of work rules. If in fact each has been found derelict of duty they must pay the consequences. Perhaps a progressive-type of discipline where a pattern of abuse rather than a one off results in termination.