Delta Air Lines is standing by its decision to throw off 18 Jewish students traveling to New York after they refused to stop eating onboard outside of “designated” meal times. The students say they were hungry and Delta did not load any Kosher meal for them.
Jewish Girls Thrown Off Delta Flight In Eating Dispute
The incident occurred Friday according to The Times of Israel. The girls had traveled from Kiev to Amsterdam on KLM and were due to continue to New York on Delta onboard DL47. After boarding, the girls began to eat their food, drawing rebukes from flight attendants. The girls will told to stop eating, but refused. Flight attendants then alerted ground staff, which called the police. The girls were then escorted off.
The group tried to rebook on a KLM flight leaving an hour later, KL641, that still would have arrived before Sabbath began on Friday, but was denied.
A local Chabad student organization arranged meals for them and the students were eventually transferred to Antwerp, Belgium where they will spend the sabbath. On Sunday, they will attempt to fly back to New York again.
Federal mask rules provide very clear exceptions for eating and drinking. While the guidelines require replacing the mask between bites and sips, they do not specify that meals can only be consumed at so-called meal times.
Even if flight attendants told the girls not to eat or drink during boarding to prevent additional exposure to other passengers, such good intentions do not seem to comport with federal rules or Delta’s own internal mask policy.
Indeed, this is the first I’ve heard that meals can only be consumed during meal time. If anything, I would think staggering meals would be “safer” because less people would have their mask off at the same time.
A Delta spokesperson said:
“A group of passengers declined to follow the instructions of our staff and were escorted out of the airplane.”
What a silly statement. If a flight attendant tells me to drink a beer or clean the toilet I’m not going to obey. Instructions must be lawful and reasonable.
Later on, Delta issued an extended statement:
The safety and well-being of our customers and our crew is always our top priority. Delta flight DL47 today from Amsterdam to New York-JFK was delayed after a group of passengers on board refused to follow the crew’s instructions.
After the group refused to leave the plane, all passengers were asked to get off the plane, according to Delta’s protocol. At 12:40 PM local time, the re-boarding process was completed, without the group. We apologize to our customers for the delay and thank our customers for their patience and understanding.
Maybe the girls were rude (they claim the flight attendants were rude). Maybe the flight attendants were power tripping. Perhaps the girls were “eating” as an excuse not to wear masks. All we have is the claim for the girls and a very vague response from Delta.
KLM has also issued a statement stating the girls did not obey crewmember instructions concerning masks on the flight from New York to Amsterdam and again from Kiev to Amsterdam. It also appears that the girls who were denied boarding were chosen alphabetically, not necessarily based upon their specific conduct.
Thus, mark this story as developing but for purposes of our discussion I am most concerned about whether Delta allows passengers to consume meals brought onboard outside of meal times. Both statements fail to address this.
CONCLUSION
I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, but it’s one or the other in this case. I can see a situation in which hungry girls were eating after no kosher food from Kiev to Amsterdam and the prospect of no kosher food again from Amsterdam to New York. Perhaps they did not replace their masks between bites. That becomes a gray area, perhaps depending upon how rapidly they were eating. But if they were simply kicked off for eating outside of “meal times” then Delta owes the students a huge apology.
image: Alexey Komarov
If it was just Delta, then why is KLM saying they also didn’t cooperate on the next flight?
The Dutch are non confrontational apparently.
Ummm, because Delta and KLM are part of the same network? Christ spud, do research and you won’t look like such a doofus.
Delta is the worse. Why would anyone fly Delta ugh
You are a moron. Delta is the safest airline on planet…Quantas is almost tied, but they do very little of the difficult flying Delta does.
Article author is a moron too…why does it matter if the girls were Jewish or not? Its clear the author is a bigot who accuses every non-Jewish person of racism.
It is better to stagger eating times so not everyone has the mask off at the same time !
Those not eating and with mask on are protected somewhat even as others eating spew viruses
Stay home and hide, wipe your groceries down, mask up in the car, triple vaccinate, make the take out driver leave the food at the end of your driveway – no one cares.
No need to stay at home if people do what they are supposed to.
You mean as they are told!!
No Masks! no Vac! business and daily life as usual! Minnesota in Town!
Even entitled teenagers have to follow the rules. I’m sure the flight attendants have absolutely had it with idiots behaving badly and showed little tolerance but for god sake we’re in a pandemic and people need to wear their frickin masks properly!
So your article basically says both Delta and KML had mask issues with the group… Regardless of race, age or religion… sounds like the group of girls were being typical disrespectful teenagers….
Not sure why everything has to turn into a race or religious issue.
It is obvious…”18 (insert race or religion) girls” gets more clicks than “18 girls”, even though this descriptor has nothing to do with the conflict in the story.
+1
Matthew has a soft spot for clickbait titles at times but I’m surprised that he chose religion as the clickbait considering that he holds strong religious beliefs himself. A surprising lack of taste.
If the social norm is children are partly acting their age, simply eating and they are removed on a flight, then, as a society, we are heading down a dark path. Flight attendant bravado, much like stupid adult passengers losing it- needs to be curtailed
The only reason the religion was brought up idiots is because they could only eat certain foods and because the the Airline didn’t have it, they ate what they brought! Y’all are really sad if you are really trying to look deeper into this than what it is! The RELIGION WAS A FOCUS POINT ONLY BECAUSE THEY COULD ONLY EAT CERTAIN FOODS! They all handled it wrong! The girls should have at least waited til meal time to eat what they brought! So, They handled it wrong!!
If a flight attendant told me to drink a beer I’d be thrilled!
I have definitely scarfed down my to-go meal after boarding with 1K but before boarding is complete on several occasions. I’ve never been asked to stop eating in the interest of keeping a mask on. I guess the only difference is that, if a flight attendant asked me to do so, this is mot the sword I’m willing to fall on and I would readily stop eating and put my mask back on.
Maybe the girls should have been permitted to do whatever they so desired with a complete disregard for authority. I don’t want to presume anything, but my guess is that they could have complied with the FA’s request until airborne, at an appropriate altitude, etc. None of them were likely going to starve. I do like how this is a “Jewish Girl” issue versus a non-compliant teen issue. Good grief!
being jewish I am not turning this into a religious issue rather a total insensitive action by a group of FA’s apparently poorly trained or just stupid. The FA’s complain and rightfully so about passengers conduct well where does this play in? I submit that this could have turned into something more ugly than it did and have yet to see an apology for Delta/KLM. There is a snarky comment to be made but I won’t. I will say things like these incidents on planes is doing as much as Covid in keeping people out of the air and I am one. Think about it up and till Covid I averaged 100+ K annually for business and 25/35 k pleasure. Thats a lot of revenue folks.
But you did turn this into a “being jewish” thing. That has bothing to do with it. Least of all by a group who thinks rules dont apply to them. Infect your own. Just stay out of my space and off my plane. Burn!
I wish I had one of these flight attendants on my Delta flight. Tons of masks off, plenty of exposed noses and the cabin crew didn’t give a $&*#. Maybe they should designate certain flights as strict masking and others as do what you wajt
Nah
Some background to that. They already ignored mask rules on KL KBP-AMS a day earlier and got IDB‘d at AMS. KLM was nice/dumb enough to rebook them but they threw a fit claiming they didn‘t feel safe on KL and wanted to get rebooked on Delta, which apparently happened. And now this…
Religious discrimination isn‘t exactly what comes to my mind when I‘m reading this.
How about this for a neutral headline: Delta removes 18 girls for not complying with FA instructions.
It helps me to know that KLM reports two negative experiences with at least some members of this group prior to this one on Delta. Had KLM given the Delta flight staff a heads up about the group’s proven behavior?
There’s also this: “After the group refused to leave the plane.” It seems that the group had become a rule unto itself. Being asked or told by airline staff to disembark is a lawful instruction.
Also, they were not going to “starve.” They brought food on board and could have waited to eat: Simply being hungry isn’t permission to ignore FA instructions, which were clear even if the accuracy of those instructions is in doubt.
I’ll give you that Delta needs to clarify its policy and have it uniformly understood and enforced by FAs, but for passengers the best default is to obey instructions on such instances and complain after the flight. In this instance, the group of 19 inconvenienced all of the other passengers by the de-planing delay.
Finally, a voice of reason.
It’s possible that the FAs thought that there should be no eating during boarding because many passengers would be walking past unmasked passengers that were eating. That’s the only plausible logic I can think of. Either that or a war against women? Or an attack on Israel?
Maybe government authorities as well as airlines worldwide should establish a rule of no eating until after take-off. The science is clear but somehow escaped the rule makers: Air circulation on the ground is nowhere like when airborne, and passengers are moving around in the aisles–for the aisle passenger that’s inches from you! Once airborne, I don’t think anyone would care if you wait until your neighbor finished eating (and puts the mask back on) before you take your mask off. Stagger all you want–when the plane is flying!
Allowing the mask off for eating/drinking is just a reasonable exemption and risk. Anything beyond the principle such as dragged out drinking and especially eating when boarding should not be allowed.
I won’t fly Delta again. Racist A*holes.
Merritt the girls being Jewish had nothing to do with the situation. We are not racists. There are no designated eating times. PAs are made repeatedly. Your mask must be over your nose and mouth during boarding and deplaning. Sounds like 18 people did not have masks on when the aisles were full of people. Delta’s priority is safety. Safety of our customers and our employees.
Merritt the girls being Jewish had nothing to do with the situation. We are not racists. There are no designated eating times. PAs are made repeatedly. Your mask must be over your nose and mouth during boarding and deplaning. Sounds like 18 people did not have masks on when the aisles were full of people. Delta’s priority is safety. Safety of our customers and our employees.
Is it a request or a lawful order re: masks during boarding/deplaning? I ask because if I bring food/drink on board and have a window seat on UA, I generally eat/drink during boarding, masking between bites/sips with nary a word from a FA. I’ve only heard general announcements about masking on board; not specific to boarding/deplaning. Or is this specific request EU-related?
I am sure you would stopped eating and masked up if the FA asked you to, or would you throw a fit and refused like it was reported how the girls responded.
Self entitled, eh? Grow up.
Delta has never been racist, they bend over backwards to be inclusive. This sounds like a response to not following Covid protocol.
I was on this flight. The flight attendants asked the girls multiple times to not eat while the plane was boarding. This back and forth went on over an hour before the decision was made to deplane and reload. They asked the girls and the pleaded with the Rabbi.
Also, if they were that hungry they could have eaten their kosher meals in the airport. It took 45 minutes to load the flight the economy was loaded last. They could have easily finished off their meals then. Many passengers missed connecting flights because of this disruption. Many lives were inconvenienced.
Thank you for clarifying this. Whomever was speaking on behalf of the group presented the situation as if the crew imposed some draconian period during the flight outside of which eating would get one kicked off.
It would’ve been much more forthright and accurate of them to have explained that this happened due to eating and failure to mask during boarding.
In any case, the fact that this group had problems on NYC-AMS, KBP-AMS, and then AMS-JFK should be raising alarms.
I will bet they had their trays down and were told to put them up and refused. The plane can’t push back and taxi if trays are down (FAA rule).
Pretty simple it seems. Eat later. A bunch of other Orthodox Jews were on the flight, chose to eat their kosher food at a later time, and didn’t wind up being told to stop eating. Or get thrown off the plane.
It may not be a normal request, but it wasn’t like they were prohibited from eating later.
Bottom line, they were given an option to eat later, and the girls refused and chose to die on that hill.
Whether they were unable to be reaccomadated due to availability or refused because they were kicked off the flight is unclear.
I’m sorry they should have eaten before they boarded if possible using the religion card is their usual go to
If this was eating during boarding process then yes this is serious breach of masking. Most airlines have special meals available upon request did they ask? Seems religion had nothing to do with it big shame on you just for ckicks! Likely just phrased wrong about only eating only at meal time. Boarding and takeoff are 100% mask time. Reasonable request, women refused they bad too much serious stuff going on. Follow reasonable requests and you fly,
If you want to fly, follow rules and instructions!
This is about what happens when passengers immediately start to eat as soon they board the plane. NOT THE TIME TO EAT. When most people eat they put the tray table down. What has to be stowed before plane movement? The tray table!! What happens if they don’t listen. Plane doesn’t move and your kicked off . Think people
Speaking of silly statements:
“What a silly statement. If a flight attendant tells me to drink a beer or clean the toilet I’m not going to obey. Instructions must be lawful and reasonable.”
Truly apples and oranges – a true stretch.
Commercial flights are a business, not a human right. Follow the rules as declared by the crew or get off the flight. It’s that simple.
Alleluia! This is the point that I am upset with is that private businesses can no longer run their business as they see fit for their business. This is not a government business where taxpayers can argue their rights. They have an obligation to follow health code regulations and laws, but that does not forbid them from making those rules even stricter. They cannot make them more relaxed but they can make them stricter. You are paying and accepting services of a private business. If you don’t like the private businesses’ practices, then don’t use their services. I am so tired of people running everyone else’s livelihood. If you walk into a store and they have rules, you follow the rules or you leave the store. If you walk into a restaurant and they want you to abide by their rules, leave if you don’t want to. I am hugely upset with groups of people with attitude controlling people who are making a living. The whole analogy of “if they told me to clean the toilet or drink a beer” is ridiculous. If such an event were to happen, then you either do it or you get off the plane. Why is that so hard to do as a sensible human being. To me it would be an analogy of someone walking into my store and deciding that they did not want to find the bathrooms so they Pee’d on the floor and told me it was my problem because the bathroom wasn’t convenient for them. I could go on and on and on about this. Everyone attempts to stand on the side of “I have rights “. Well I say businesses have rights to run their business how they see fit. We are teaching An entire generation to disobey all rules. This is not the same as standing up for any quality and human rights. It’s spoiled people who want everything the way they want it irregardless of how it affects others. I say your rights and where mine begin. Your rights do not overtake my rights!
nevermind the whole component of INTERNATIONAL TRAVEL. I work for one of the major US carriers. international c19 regulations are ever changing on a daily basis. so an international flight is going to be even MORE stringent w rules & regulations respectful of the merging of pax from different countries departing one country and entering into another country.
it is never as simplistic as it appears. trust that the airline is taking into account the SAFETY of the group as a whole.
delaying an international flight w how many pax on board ? the aircraft us then needed down line so that flight & pax are impacted? the gate of said is occupied not vacating to allow the next arriving flight to park and deplane. there are so many moving parts I could go on and on.
bottom line…. comply.
The airlines were given $$$ for support during covid. How many private businesses were supported like them. Now the attitude is from the crew. They are lucky to have a job. Since when was there ever a designated time to eat? Only when they serve stale crackers and water? Hard to choose which airline is worse.
I wonder if these girls were high at the time. Smoking pot makes me very hungry. The first time I tried it I ended up in the hospital. I smoked half a joint and ate the other half.
I have a hard time believing all of the comments on this situation when we don’t know all of the facts. Why does this society have to complain, add their opinion, have reflex comments when you don’t have all the facts? And Matthew basically promotes this behavior.
Hi kettle! Im pot. You’re black!
I agree with you 200%
Stan, i agree with you. I have heard the story firsthand from one of the girls fathers who is my college. THEY ARE NOT ACCUSED OF EATING OUT OF MEALTIME ON THE DELTA FLIGHT. Read up some more about the story before you make conclusions. So all of you that are busy arguing about their food, know your details first, before you put up a fight.
You need a Kosher Meal? You need to order it up front. It’s the girls fault for not getting their meals they need. Neither KLM or Delta fault. Where has common courtesy gone in the WOKE world?
If you ever tried ordering a special meal before, you would no that 9 out of 10 times the airline doesn’t have it.
My plane. My rules. End of story. Don’t like my rules? Fly someone else’s plane.
Only if the rules are enforced fairly. And preferably with good rationale.
In this case it appears that both were present.
Sadly there is tons of valid anti Semiticism out there. But incidents like this serve to undermine addressing that problem by adding “You can’t criticize us – We’re Jews” to real bigotry
@ Carl Schaffer, seems to me that since the DL flight was NOT their untended flight and they ended up on it < 24 hrs there was no way for DL to get them any special meal, so that wasnt the girls fault! However what I dont get is unless the food came say 10 mins before they were to board why did they eat it in the airport? and it they chose not to why not wait till the plane is airbourne. These arent the 1st people kicked off for eating during boarding I would think folks would have learnt from others who got the boot
The girls had spent the night airside and received food in the morning.
Never knew eating during boarding is any more grave than doing so in flight. Coming from me, a rather seasoned traveler, what does that say about this group, of whom many members were flying for the very first time?
You can’t remove your mask during boarding. People are walking toward you, sometimes mere inches from you (if they’re putting items in the overhead compartments, for example), and it is a serious breach of mask protocols. They were asked multiple times to keep their masks on, and refused, using the “mask off while eating” excuse, so that’s why the timing of their meals came into the discussion. The girls were 100% in the wrong.
As a seasoned traveler, surely you know that masks must be on during boarding
How difficult is it to proofread an article before posting? There’s a mistaken in the very first sentence for goodness sake.
How about your start by proof reading your own comment.
hahaha
Attorney here… will take their case if they contact our group… we have been cleaning up over this mask mandate nonsense… so easy for us to see on basis of discrimination and the airlines have been willing to settle for high dollar amounts every time. Contacts us at hostile law group.
..and that is why I do not want to travel at the moment. Strict pandemic policies against those who would not comply…Flying right now is like playing Russian Roulette! You do not know in which situation you will catch the disease or being jailed for not complying to rules!
You hear and see how people suddenly behaving rudely onboard or just playing power play with the crew. And most of all..the countries I want to travel are closed anyway!
So why bother and make all the fuss and spend money for second choice trips you do not really want to do, just for the sake of flying and showing off..” I am not afraid..the disease would not get me..”.
There will be time for a proper travelling again..internationally. Till then there are still places in my country which I have not seen. It is a chance to know my country a bit more.
Just a response to some of the comments below. Currently it is NOT possible to order any special meals (kosher or otherwise). Airlines say that will not change until the masking mandate lifts. Personally I don’t see how one has to do with the other (meals are being served any way…why is there an added covid risk if those meals cater to vegans, kosher, etc). The girls did not have an option to have kosher meals provided by the airline.
But do the girls have to eat immediately upon boarding as was reported?
Hum! If this was 18 people of color, or Muslims…? Would the same rules apply? Just asking…
Thinking the EXACT thing Elizabeth!
If we’re finishing up boarding and getting ready to push back, and a flight attendant asked me to stow my food, put the tray table up and mask up, saying I can resume my meal later…I’d simply do it. I’d also then be home when I planned.
This is why I say as of two years ago, Delta needs to be bitten by a class action law suit! For all the people who are struggling to just survive in life!
really ? why ?
Way too many things don’t add up in this story. We are told that the group refused flight attendant instructions to wear masks on 2 previous flights, that leads me to believe there’s more at play here. I don’t buy the excuse that they were not eating at the right time. I suspect it has more to do with masks, as so many incidents do now. Hopefully we will hear more about what was really going on.
Sigh
Read the entire thread. They had their masks off during boarding – which is apparently a standard violation as other passengers are moving past you. “Eating” and “time of day” are peripheral.
If you refuse to follow crewmember instructions…its pretty simple. Sayonara.
Earlier comment by a passenger on the plane states they were asked several times to comply. This along with reported issues on 2 earlier flights, tells me they are teenagers with attitude. It has absolutely nothing to do with religion. The eating at the wrong time us just a smoke screen for the real issue of not wearing masks during boarding and potentially exposing anyone walking through the aisle. Delta did the right thing.
Several years ago while vacationing at beach resort we visited often, we were kept awake all evening by a large group of teens dressed in Jewish religious clothing, who screamed, laughed and slammed doors until all hours in the night, and punished all hotel guests who had the audacity to complain with a middle-of-the-night “knock and run” and pile of litter dumped in front of their hotel room door. A call to the front desk confirmed the teens were staying as part of a group, and the staff assured us they were attempting to contact the so-called “chaperones” to address the matter before calling the police. The following morning at sunrise, we again were woken by this same group, however, this time it was the Rabbi who was literally screaming 6am morning prayers to the now-silent group of teens outside our beachfront balcony. Later that morning, I spoke to the front-desk clerk with whom I’d had a friendly exchange when we ourselves had checked in the previous day. She confirmed the group from New York had checked out, apologized for the inconvenience and assured us they group had been told they were not allowed to return in the future. She added, however, that decision was made not only because of the late-night antics, but rather due to their racist comments to several African American staff members, as well as complete and total disrespect of hotel staff and guests in general.
Based on that experience, I’m giving Delta and KLM the benefit of the doubt on this one until facts prove otherwise.
Phony victimology. People of another background have had to put up with this kind of nonsense for years.