While taxpayer bailouts protected all U.S. airline jobs during the pandemic, United eliminated its international crew bases and many of those flight attendants are still without a job, even as United is now hiring new flight attendants. Should United hire these flight attendants back even if they cannot legally work in the USA?
Time For United Airlines To Re-Hire International Flight Attendants
First, let’s be clear. United Airlines did not simply fire flight attendants at bases in:
- Frankfurt (FRA)
- Hong Kong (HKG)
- Tokyo (TYO)
Instead, flight attendants were offered a transfer to a U.S. base (or London, the last remaining non-U.S. flight attendant base, but only if openings existed). But that required documentation to work in the USA and many of these flights attendants, who were Asian or European nationals, had no such paperwork. Thus, they were effectively sacked.
> Read More: United Airlines Closing Three International Flight Attendant Bases
Under a deal negotiated with the Association of Flight Attendants (AFA), flight attendants from these closed international bases can still be rehired if they obtain documentation to work in the U.S. (or London) by March 31, 2023.
But with that deadline approaching, the AFA is pushing United to re-hire these flight attendants regardless of work status (i.e. re-open international bases) and has released a poignant new video showing some of the faces and stories of the displaced FAs:
Indeed, United is hiring throughout the company, including new flight attendants. Omar Idris, who is United’s chief at Chicago O’Hare (ORD) recently noted:
“We have 500 new airplanes coming to United Airlines over the next few years. That’s an airplane every three or four days for us, so we need folks to help work those aircraft.”
Therefore, there is a need for these flight attendants. If not now, soon. But should United hire them back?
My answer is yes. I realize that this is a complex issue and there is a certain degree of helpful uniformity in ensuring that all flights attendants can work in the U.S. (or UK). It is also true that the pandemic did change the world and in East Asia, United’s operations remain weak there.
But a former Frankfurt-based flight attendant put it well:
“With crew shortages all over the place, UA should make use of these fine former flight attendants they kicked down the cliff in 2020, and who had been praised for their dedicated service not only in online frequent flyer forums for decades beforehand. These folks would not need expensive initial training, all they require is requalification. They are scattered throughout Europe. And those who were stationed in HKG and NRT are all over the place in Asia. And many of them would return to flying today if it were offered to them. They are experienced and multi-lingual. Characteristics that are desperately sought after among flight crews now more than ever.”
United’s new slogan is “good leads the way” and while it may not be legally obligated to hire these flight attendants back, it should. Many of these flight attendants have given decades to United and were joyful and compassionate brand ambassadors in the air. Sure, their higher seniority will cost the company more, but it would be an important capstone in recognizing the shared sacrifice United employees went through during the pandemic.
In terms of corporate citizenship, this gesture means much more to me than carbon offsets and electric airplanes.
CONCLUSION
United Airlines is hiring again and displaced flights attendants are knocking at the door. The coming months strike me as the perfect time for United to show in a very tangible way that “good leads the way” by re-hiring these flight attendants who have given their careers to United but can (understandably) not secure the rights to work in the USA.
I dont think Hong Kong will ever come back to what it was, so I cannot imagine a base opening there again. At most, United might in the future have 2-3 flights a day at HKG. A base is not needed with that low level of activity. Tokyo? Maybe, but the days of Tokyo being a connecting hub operation for United are long over, and I cannot see United needing a base there for the handful of flights to the US it will operate. Delta operates up to or over 20 flights a day at Amsterdam and they dont have a crew base there. Why should United reopen a base at Frankfurt when they have at most 10-12 flights a day? Sure it would be nice, but economics have changed.
Whether it is re-opening bases or simply sponsoring visas, I just think UA FAs who have been with the company in some cases for 30+ years should not just be shown the door.
I agree with you but United has to follow US law. For the flight attendants impacted they still have an opportunity to return to work with their seniority intact all they have to do is obtain the required documentation to legally work in the United States.
I don’t see United ever reopening the base at HKG. Once Japan fully reopens without any restrictions I think might be a change the NRT base reopens only because United will run a split operation with around 10 or 12 total daily flights from both NRT and HND having a crew base in NRT might work in UA’s favor. The FRA base might come back but I highly doubt it, personally I don’t see the need for an FRA base
I agree. I know nothing about airlines. But, from my “Coffee, Tea, or Me” days; I was led to believe if you wanted to work an international flight, you had to speak a foreign language. For example; a NY to Paris flt attendant would have to speak English and French. Is this no longer the case? By the way, love your column. .
This is still the case, United tries to staff flight attendants fluent in the language of the destination but unfortunately it went down from 3 flight attendants per flight to two and sometimes even one crewmember per flight and that is a sad state of things, especially because other US carriers (hello Delta) have gotten back to pre pandemic staffing.
Why are you saying there is no connecting traffic in Tokyo anymore? Ana is still there, isn’t United funneling traffic to Ana?
Yes, but United doesnt operate the flights from Tokyo to points beyond in Asia anymore, so it doesnt need flight attendants to operate the flights. Whereas up to 10-15 years ago, United had a hub in Tokyo and did fly its own flights to points beyond in Asia and did need flight attendants to do so.
100,000s of native Hongkongers have moved to the UK under the BNO visa scheme. No doubt many of the ~300 former UA FAs are eligible. But can UA rehire them at LHR?
That’s another option. Expand the LHR base.
They can’t just expand the LHR base to accommodate flight attendants who were furloughed. For the LHR base to be expanded United would need to increase its flying to LHR and right now United is using every LHR slot they have. With no airline partner in LHR the chances of United growing LHR beyond where they are today is slim. For United to expand the LHR base to accommodate a large percentage of international flight attendants who were furloughed United would need to operate around 30-40 daily flights from LHR.
Also if I’m not mistaken LHR based flight attendants do not work any domestic flights, they only work flight to/from LHR.
I’m not sure of the specifics, but during the pandemic there were some LHR FAs griping to me (privately) about having to do EWR-TLV/BOM/DEL, which are among the least desirable longhaul routes to fly (because the clientele on those flights tend to be the most demanding, or so I’m told…).
Back in 2018-20, HKG FAs were working flights such as HKG-SFO-HND-SFO-HKG in a W pattern. So it is entirely possible for LHR FAs to work other US-EU routes too.
The London flight attendants also had (or have) to fill in for all the fired FRA co-workers. So, LHR all of a sudden ended up with unpopular 6-day “W” assignments: LHR-USA-Europe-USA-LHR with three nights at three different hotels per trip, e.g. in Washington, Munich and Chicago.
The flight attendant union in LHR is also fighting for UA to bring the ex-colleagues back because flights out of London are constantly understaffed all the time, the local crews are forced to work high-time monthly schedules, nobody wants those week-long assignments (3-day trips – or even 2-day trips out of London – are the transatlantic standard) etc.
Are there any vacancies currently at the London station?
The current LHR flight attendant vacancies will not be posted by UA management before April 1, 2023, as has been explained by one of the other commentators, who seems to have greater insight into the matter, further below. 🙁 🙁
Thank you so much for standing up for us. Indeed hundreds of us made United become a world wide airline back in the 90 s when it was mostly a midwestern not known abroad. Back then CEO recruited high educated multi languages interpreters (6 international Bases-London Paris Taiwan Tokyo Hong-Kong Francfort) to achieve a worldwide reputation to compete other major airlines which we succeeded… During my almost 28 years of seniority with the proper C1dVisa – still valid and my own passport needed to fly back and forth US to Europe or world except domestic USA, we didn’t need US ” proper paper”, nor we need a base as satellite is sufficient “to report”, everyone knows that… England has numerous us citizens, and no one of us, separated, took on our brother and sisters there… We, haven’t forgot Sept 11 2001, we were there, nor were we exempt from union dues for almost 30 years, but still we excluded overnight from the job, the company we love, the life we had… Think about, some of you claiming we shouldn’t be returning, how did United become that prosperous? You might remember we made this company also… We’re there in the 90 s when we remember Air France in cdg only being annoyed by our success, and Lufthansa making sure we would get in the alliance to remain competitive and keep our customers in our web… I could tell so much about this life that “covid”? took from me… Come on United, Remember me and my hundreds of people in those 3 bases closed on September 2020…
Evelyne PECORARD FN 137394 ex cdg ex fra ex United #ReUnited… Thank you for reading me.
I have frequently travelled on United flights that have been staffed by foreign based flights who gave me and other passengers excellent service. United Airlines should be an advocate for rehiring these ambassadors of quality immediately. Loyalty breeds loyalty. United Airlines “ don’t be a dick!”
You have no idea how much we appreciate your post. Of course United will keep its London base closed until April 01/2923 We have been in service for 29plus years without any requirements to possess any so called US passport or Green Card. And suddenly it becomes a requirement to fire us. And to let us go with all these years of service without any compensation or the much earned travel privileges. ???
“All they have to do is obtain documentation to legally work in the US” that is next to impossible to do without United sponsoring them, and they still likely would not be approved even if United did sponsor them.
Thank you! This is so true . Suddenly, after quite 30 years of good service, we need us working papers… Internationally we don’t.
So how is any of this United Airlines fault? Airlines around the world shuttered international bases how many have reopened those bases? As SG112587 pointed out even if United were to sponsor the displaced flight attendants it is still nearly impossible for you to get approval to work in the US. I don’t know how the laws are in the UK and if there is anything United can do in the UK to help out displaced flight attendants from Germany. Have the laws changed in the UK as a result of Brexit?
United hasn’t forgotten about you that is why they’ve given impacted flight attendants until March 31, 2023 but at the same time United does not control the United States government or have influence on who is awarded those coveted US work visa’s.
What cities in the US does United have FA bases at? All the hubs, including LAX, or was LAX closed?
Are there any other non-hub cities that have FA bases?
United has flight attendant bases at ORD, DEN, EWR, IAD, SFO, LAX, IAH, GUM, and I believe HNL. United also has satellite bases which are a sub-base of another much larger base, the satellite bases are MCO, PHX, and SAN. Before the pandemic there was talk of opening more satellite bases (it really helps commuters) however I think those plans have been put on hold.
BOS, Boston too.
Are you pointing to the fact that United can open/ shut bases at their whims and fancies? We didn’t need any the so called documents earlier for all these years. Why this stipulation now??
yes, there are…San Diego is a crew base, but not a hub. I have seen a list and there are definitely other crew bases, but can’t remember.
No, they shouldn’t. If the flying can be covered by US based flight attendants, which all their flying can be, the answer should be undoubtedly no.
Then EVERY ONE of those U.S. FA’s should be a language speaker IMHO
You must not have flown UA on flights staffed by the foreign based FA’s. The majority of my first million miles on UA were flown on flights that were. The friendliness, sophistication, care and professionalism of those FA’s *far* exceeded that of any US air carrier’s FA’s and were easily on a par with those of any foreign carrier (maybe bar SQ/EK).
Keep the crews for Ual flts based ONLY in the USA. Foreign bases causes problems. Businesswise code sharing flts with other foreigm carriers is cost effective, and quality control will be enhanced and retained on the usa side.
Time to allow foreign airlines to compete on domestic routes in the US. Time for congress to be a little less corrupt.
We sponsor people for work visas and allow competition in labor but do not allow the same competition in business.
Inside (UA CEO) Scott Kirby’s – „the numbers guy“ – mind in April/May 2020 when transatlantic air travel was shut down:
* Senior flight attendants are expensive for us (higher hourly rates), they tend to be sick more often and they don’t easily put up with all the hypocritically dishonest marketing bullshit („Core4 We Care“, „Good leads the way“ etc.) we regularly throw at them.
* The flight attendants at our three international bases (FRA, NRT, HKG) wo are equal union members (and work flights into and out of but not within the US on crew visas together with their US co-workers on the same planes) were hired starting in 1990, thus none of them has less than 23 years of seniority, = old and expensive (the youngest ones among them are in their mid-40s).
* Let’s use the covid19 pandemic as a perfect excuse to close these bases and thus get rid of a lot of expensive overhead once and for all. We can then play Pontius Pilate and publicly say „But we had no other choice!“
* Let’s allow those few US citizens or greencard holders among them to return to a US base, because otherwise the union will rip us apart, and let’s tell the rest that London will remain open, yes, but that there is no need for them there, so they cannot transfer to the UK, and that they will be separated from the company. Knowing (and hoping) that it may be nearly impossible for them to do, let’s tell the foreigners among them that they can, of course, come back to flying if they manage by themselves to get US work and residence permits, haha. If, indeed, some of them succeed with that, through marriage for example, punish them by reducing their seniority from the time of separation to their presentation of US work documentation.
* Let’s categorically deny all requests by the soon-to-be-fired flight attendants to go on multi-year unpaid furloughs to buy themselves some time, because that way, we will not get rid of them for good. Let our US flight attendants, at the same time, go on voluntary furloughs and take unpaid monthly leaves, as they please, because that saves us a lot of money.
* Let’s send our overseas flight attendants a nice one-page termination letter via FedEx thanking them for their decades of service and wishing them a great life. Offer retiree benefits only to those who qualify by age and years of service. Do not offer any monetary compensation at all (such as severance pay). It’s covid’s fault, after all, that they have to go, not ours!
* When the union pressures us, let’s promise to bring these employess back to the London base, but only if we open that base for transfers or new hires before March 31, 2023. — >>> Important note to HR and the manager of LHR: do not open LHR for transfers or new hires before April 1, 2023 under any circumstances, even if we have to cancel one flight after the other out of LHR because of all the shortages there in the coming months!!!
* When our overseas flight attendants see no other option but to take us to foreign labor courts, let’s send a reckless lawyer after them who alleges in court that these international bases of ours were never anything more than waiting rooms in cases of delays, let alone “places of work”, that none of the supervisor staff there actually had any authority whatsoever and that all of these flight attendants were actually employed on paper out of Chicago, so that only US labor law applies. When the foreign labor courts don’t buy any of this bullshit, then offer these flight attendants some money and retiree travel benefits to convince them to give up their lawsuits; otherwise we will drag out the court proceedings until they all run out of money, no problem. Some of them will have to move out of their apartments or sell their houses to pay for their families and their lawyers; they won’t be able to hang in there forever.
* Let’s make sure that we have good counter-arguments for all alternative options that these international flight attendants may bring forward for their re-employment, such as „let all the flight attendants from FRA, NRT and HKG transfer to LHR on Ocotber 1, 2020, and then start there – from most junior in inverse seniority order – to implement furloughs, and then gradually bring these furloughed flight attendants back once traffic picks up“ or „once traffic picks up, create a virtual base in the US for international flight attendants – there was a time at UA when the big bases in the US were split into domestic vs. international operations after all – to work on flights into and out of but not within the US like in all those decades before, no special work permits required, especially if, according to management, these international bases supposedly were never ‘real bases’ in the first place“ or „work together with the USCIS to see if special work permits can be obtained for these flight attendants after job postings in the US looking for multilingual crew members for certain languages do not result in employment of US citizens“ etc. etc.
* Play down or ignore any moral or emotional arguments such as that these overseas flight attendants are a cultural enrichment for this globally operating company, that their employement is completely in line with our diversity approach, that they helped re-build this company after 9/11 and bankruptcy, that they continuously ranked on the top of our customer surveys among all UA bases etc. etc.
* Let a few months pass, so that it’s not too obviosus, especially since we are using the „sorry, no capacity“ scheme to fend off the requests by these international flight attendants, before we start to hire new flight attendants at low hourly rates in the US like crazy. Some of which then can transfer to LHR on or after April 1, 2023!!!
* Oh, and yes, bring my CEO compensation for 2021 up to 9.85 million dollars! Thank you all!
What you wrote, Erik, may sound cynical and nasty to the average reader, but it probably sums up pretty much exactly what was and is going on in Kirby’s and his executive friends’ minds with regard to that matter.
That’s a great idea to hire previous fully trained and experinced professionals instead of new
….except they will need to be RE-qualified on ALL aircraft types and iterations in the fleet, not just the ones they flew previously: 787 (4 variants), 777 (8 variants), 767 (5 variants), 757 (3 variants), 737 (10! variants) and Airbus 319/320/321NX (4 total). Granted, the RIFs were short-notice and didn’t leave much wiggle room, but these off-shore employees didn’t comply with American laws either.
This is why the US should have freedom of movement regulations. Citizens of the UK, Belgium, France, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Denmark, Sweden, Germany, Austria, Italy, Spain, Portugal, New Zealand, Palau, Micronesia, Marshall Islands, Australia, Singapore, Taiwan, and Japan should have unfettered access to live and work in the US and vice versa. It should not be extended to all EU countries or there will be a flood of Polish people taking away jobs from Americans. Polish people accept low wages and are white, taking away jobs from African Americans.
Interesting. I cant work in those countries without a Visa to include UK and AU. Hell, cant even do it Canada (hell, know lots of people thrown out of Canada cause they thought it was ‘work vs business’. None of those want to allow US persons to come and work without restrictions. I am awaiting an Australian work Visa and even with Australian government sponsorship its slow. Its never going to be like the EU as you wish.
“Sure, their higher seniority will cost the company more…..”
You hit the nail on the bullseye Big M!
Great aim! Now aim a nail at Uniteds cold corporate heart! Oops, never mind, you can’t kill something already lifeless!
And question: so the bailouts they got didn’t protect the foreign workers jobs?
The truth of the matter is all these FA’s should be rehired! They provide excellent service overall, do not feel as entitled as their American counterparts, and provide excellent and warm customer service. You guys all know it!! Cmon!! Let’s be honest here and give credit where credit is due!! I personally have experienced it and felt it too. Coming back from Singapore that one time, my Hong Kong based FA could have not been nicer, more accommodating and warm. Much much better than the US based crap we’re obligated to face on a daily basis!!
US based crap. Your Mommy must be proud how you speak of others. Go back to your basement. Your slurpee is melting.
Awww Lcat, hit a nerve there!! Are you part of that crap as well!!hmm hmm do your goddamned job well or let others who are really willing to do it well takeover. Now, how does that sound, too rude for you??? Awwwww…
Let’s been honest here the HKG base is never coming back. Whenever Hong Kong fully reopens without any covid restrictions there will more than likely only be one United nonstop flight from SFO. I don’t see ORD or EWR coming back any time soon and United had already canceled all intra-Asia flight from HKG years ago. HKG is done the writing was on the wall before COVID.
Now that is still a chance for the NRT base to reopen with UA perhaps running 10-12 daily flight out of Tokyo (NRT/HND) once Japan fully reopens without restrictions. As far as FRA I’m torn as to whether that base will reopen if it does it will be because the AFA fought to get it reopened.
Perhaps, but it doesn’t mean right away. Give all these guys temporary assignments for the next 2 to 3 years and then reinstall the bases. I have learned through time the words “never” and “won’t “ have to be used very carefully! Just my two cents.
The irony of this is that I found the foreign based flight attendants to be far superior and motivated to deliver a great product in the air. In far contrast to the senior U.S. based FA’s, especially at Dulles, who seemingly can’t be bothered.
The reality is that they will never be brought back. Those bases are no longer needed and Covid was the excuse for UA to move on and reshuffle at lower costs. However, these FA’s should be offered every possibility and option for assistance in other ways. First to figure out a system that allows them to work in the U.S. with either an H1 visa applications or the ability to commute. At the very least they could be offered assistance with Star Alliance partners in securing jobs with other airlines.
This is a tough situation and I assume the worst. Corporations today will have little empathy in an ability to abandon its workers when it sees a cheaper window open. Probably they should look for other airline jobs on their own, i.e Emirates even if it means starting over with seniority.
The thing is, Scott Kirby himself got the boot after twenty years by his ‘friends’ at American Airlines, i.e. the board and its CEO Doug Parker. They made Robert Isom president, and fired Kirby. Who then fled to United, where they made him president and later CEO. A burnt child knows the fire. So Kirby knows what ‘unscrupulous’ and ‘reckless’ means. But the big difference is: Kirby walked away with a 13 million dollar severance package from American and a fat compensation package at his new job at United, year after year since then. These international flight attendants, who were hired by United more than two decades before Kirby arrived, were kicked out with his approval more or less over night with ZERO dollars in severance compensation and without a buddy-buddy deal for a new, well paid job with the competition. Go find a job elsewhere at age 53+, after you spent your entire work life as a flight attendant with United! “Thank you for your service and good-bye”.
You’re such a funny guy. You really need to get out more. Speaking of doing your job, I’m wondering if you could even hold one down with your attitude. Not likely. Have a great day!
CX did the same thing, closed all international crew bases, laid off all international employees, now operate with HKG based crew only….it will be a long, long time (maybe never) before it’s back to the way it was before the Covid farce was hatched.
This article is a new standard in nonsense, written by someone who knows better.
TYO is no longer a hub. Everything is a turnaround back to the states.
HKG never was a hub. That it even had a domicile is something left over from Pan Am flying boat days. In any case, Xi has eviscerated HKG as a finance and business center and it isn’t coming back.
Why FRA is a domicile is also a Pan Am legacy. That one is left over from the IGS service.
As if some who is in her 50’s and has lived all her life in Hong Kong or Tokyo will want to uproot and move to the US…
But the best part of this nonsense is that foreign flight attendants are not part of the US AFA contract. If all the legal barriers and other impediments could be overcome, these flight attendants would be at the bottom of the seniority list and would be on ready reserve in ORD, waiting to find out if they were going to PVD or BOI that day.
AFA made dang sure when UA bought Pan Am London that those high seniority Brits would never sashay into the plumb routes.
Fake news, Goforride! Are you mixing up the “foreign national” flight attendants who used to work intra-Asia United flights only out of BKK and SIN back in the days, wore different uniforms and never worked together with mainland US crews on the one hand, and non-US United flight attendants based in FRA, NRT, HKG, LHR (and formerly CDG, TPE, SCL) who were/are equal AFA members on the US United payroll and work(ed) transatlantic and transpacific longhaul flights, wearing the exact same mainland UA uniforms, together with their US-based United co-workers on the same aircraft (mixed crews) on the other hand? The former were let go decades ago, and some of them started from scratch in NRT or HKG as AFA members. The latter – at least the ones out of LHR – work transatlantic flights together with US based crews to this day. US based United flight attendants could and did transfer to FRA, NRT HKG, LHR, CDG, TPE and SCL, by the way, – but not to SIN or BKK. Those US citizens or greencard holders who transfered from FRA, NRT and HKG to Stateside bases in October 2020 kept their original seniorities from the 1990s. And those few who managed to obtain US work permits on their own afterwards lost a few months of seniority accrual but still have around 25 years. Get your facts together before you confuse the readers with your pmCO untruths!
pmCo?
huh?
All that gibberish you posted is fascinating, but the question at hand is about UA “hiring” foreigners. We’re not talking about US citizens living abroad (BTW, you can’t hold a Green Card and hold permanent employment outside the US. Kinda defeats the “permanent” and “resident” thing.). We’re talking about UA sponsoring someone, which would means the company would have to attest that is could not find a us resident to do the job, or that the individuals possess some unique qualification as in artists or other special skills.
If someone in the domiciles mentioned had US citizenship, they could move here and go to work for UA in the normal manner.
The foreign flight attendants most definitely are not covered by the same AFA contract as the domestic ones.
Think about that. How could individuals in Japan enforce contract provisions of a contract drawn between a US union and a US company in the US in Japanese courts? You think you can call the NLRB if you’re not getting your contract provisions upheld in Japan?
Hey Neverfull, don’t bother about commentator “Goforride”. She obviously has no profound knowledge about the situation. Probably a troll.
“We’re talking about UA sponsoring someone, which would means [sic] the company would have to attest that is [sic] could not find a us resident to do the job”. —- actually UA is having major problems with finding flight attendants in the US who fluently speak certain languages for all their (new) international routes. And all of us who are bi- or multilingual have heard the horrible announcements in foreign languages on US airplanes by individuals who were certainly not proficient in that language. Whether that’s enough for a work permit? That’s another question.
“If someone in the domiciles mentioned had US citizenship, they could move here and go to work for UA in the normal manner.” —- those with US citizenship and the greencard holders were offered transfers to US bases on October 1, 2020. And as for the greencard holders who were based out of FRA, NRT and HKG: they flew to the States once a week and spent 24 or 48 hours there for work. Plus the flight time over US territory. Plus the time they spent in the States apart from work throughout the year – at their apartments or houses. That brings them to 180 days per year (that latter of which are not even a requirement anymore). Some of them were even air commuters going back and forth for more or less every assignment.
“The foreign flight attendants most definitely are not covered by the same AFA contract as the domestic ones.” —- uh, yes they are! Exactly the same AFA contract. You can read it online. And the overseas bases are explicitly mentioned in it. The only difference for the non-US citizens without green cards, who had crewmember visas, was that they couldn’t be used on domestic routes.
“How could individuals in Japan enforce contract provisions of a contract drawn between a US union and a US company in the US in Japanese courts?” —- there are legal requirements in ‘host countries’ that foreign corporations need to abide by if they set up shop there, even if the employment is based on an overseas work contract, which is recognized by the courts. Thanks, globalization! The current United management tried to argue that the international bases, for over 20 years, were never ‘places of work’ but merely waiting rooms where coffee and tea was served, so that the staff would not be bound by more employee-friendly overseas labor laws, but that ‘nice try’ (“We are an American company, we can behave the way we want to, and you foreigners can’t tell us anything!”) didn’t work.
I always travel by United. I am very comfortable with this airline and it’s handling of passengers. I am disappointed that United has not yet rehired those flight attendants. During my several flights to Frankfurt, for example, those international flight attendants were exceptionally helpful and they indeed made the long flights pleasant. I believe United should hire them immediately for their outstanding service to the airline and passengers.
To the writer of this blog-post, you seem waaaaay too invested in United Airlines’ internal affairs compared to the other legacy airlines out there. May I hazard a guess that your spouse is one of those former FRA-based FAs? It might not be the case seeing that if they were married to you then that could make them a US National with the right to work for a US company — but I digress…
At the end of the day, a company does not necessarily “owe” anything to anyone that was not covered in their mutually-agreed upon work contract. Those same FAs who are in Europe (or wherever), they are *more* than welcome to apply to work for the many airlines based in the regions/countries out there for which they have work permits. If they truly cared about delivering stellar customer service, then the uniform worn shouldn’t matter. Emirates is hiring. As is KLM. Apply for and work there.
The real story here is that you have far too many folks in the field who think it’s their “right’ to have the job. But, truly, where else can one work with no more than a minimum of a secondary school diploma or G.E.D. equivalent, make over six figures, yet go to work (if they actually *go* to work instead of just dropping or trading trips out) and sleep/rest for nearly 40% of the time? I mean, really, the entitlement displayed by some of the most vocal ones in that lot is truly disgusting. Can you imagine if a typical worker arrives at work at 08h, worked until about 1030h, slept/hid away until 1330h, then “worked” (gossip, eat, read, *maybe* do a little bit of actual work) until about 1700h and then goes off to do whatever they wanted in either their layover city or home domicile? Oh, and maybe do that for 8 days a month. And get paid over $10k/month. Really?
At the end of the day, those individuals still have choices yet still want to blame and bad-mouth the company that they’re literally trying to get back into. They’ve had years to figure out what they want to do and sort out their situations. They don’t care about the company or the customers, they care only about what benefits themselves. There were plenty of nasty and snooty FAs back in the FRA, CDG, NRT, HKG bases just as there are in the current bases.
Found this in spam. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. I have no spouse or family that works for United.
I’m a 45+ years Flight attendant with United and fought against opening foreign domiciles. They halted the much despised weight restrictions in order to take our flying overseas. You work for a foreign carrier, you are not qualified to work on the US.
“not qualified”? as in trained? they had the exact same initial and recurrent flight attendant training as you.
And don’t forget that these overseas bases were opened initially with transfers from US bases, with Americans who embraced the idea of living abroad (for some time) while continuing to work for the same company. To the very end, US citizens and residents were based out of NRT, HKG and FRA, and still are in LHR. And they loved their lives over there, and many of them even learned the local language.
Just trying to figure out why my comment is not seeming to be appear here …
Which comment? I have not blocked any.
Thank you for the quick reply, here it is:
To the writer of this blog-post, you seem quite invested in United Airlines’ internal affairs compared to the other legacy airlines out there. May I hazard a guess that your spouse is one of those former FRA-based FAs? It might not be the case seeing that if they were married to you then that could make them a US National with the right to work for a US company — but I digress…
At the end of the day, a company does not necessarily “owe” anything to anyone that was not covered in their mutually-agreed upon work contract. Those same FAs who are in Europe (or wherever), they are *more* than welcome to apply to work for the many airlines based in the regions/countries out there for which they have work permits. If they truly cared about delivering stellar customer service, then the uniform worn shouldn’t matter. Emirates is hiring. As is KLM. Apply for and work there.
The real story here is that you have far too many folks in the field who think it’s their “right’ to have the job. But, truly, where else can one work with no more than a minimum of a secondary school diploma or G.E.D. equivalent, make over six figures, yet go to work (if they actually *go* to work instead of just dropping or trading trips out) and sleep/rest for nearly 40% of the time? I mean, really, the entitlement displayed by some of the most vocal ones in that lot is truly disgusting. Can you imagine if a typical worker arrives at work at 08h, worked until about 1030h, slept/hid away until 1330h, then “worked” (gossip, eat, read, *maybe* do a little bit of actual work) until about 1700h and then goes off to do whatever they wanted in either their layover city or home domicile? Oh, and maybe do that for 8 days a month. And get paid over $10k/month. Really?
At the end of the day, those individuals still have choices yet still want to blame and bad-mouth the company that they’re literally trying to get back into. They’ve had years to figure out what they want to do and sort out their situations. They don’t care about the company or the customers, they care only about what benefits themselves. There were plenty of nasty and snooty FAs back in the FRA, CDG, NRT, HKG bases just as there are in the current bases.
I know this is a digression. But you seem to know a lot about United flight attendants. If they truly make six figure income doing minimum work for eight days a month, United should be able to choose from very qualified job seeking candidates when they hire. Why do they hire these lazy, entitled, undereducated, monolingual flight attendants?
The F/A bases were a legacy issue (PAN AM ) when a B707 or early B747 could barely make it to Tel Aviv without a stop on the way. Honolulu was a jumping off point on the way to Australia and Asia. Today, airlines can fly non-stop from North America to the Middle East or India. Same thing to the Pacific Basin. That’s the whole concept behind the B787 or A350….very long legs.
Having a few F/As in London would be nice, but on the condition that they would be required to dash to Paris, Berlin or Milan to meet up with a US bound flight that is short on staffing.
Do u even know writing this article the history of foreign base idea with United? It was part retaliation against the union which did not agree to put more than 2 language speaker positions on a wide body aircraft. The fact is it did give the company some benefits of having lower paid FAs flying premium routes for a while. But now they r on top scale, and the office lease and staff r very costly. And did u forget how many US citizens/residents’ positions they were taking all this time? It was ironic that an American union was protecting the foreign workers. In fact, I am holding Tokyo trips for the first time in 30 years now. I couldn’t hold it till now because of NRT base. And during pandemic shut down, they were getting paid staying home thanks to the US tax payers, while we were flying risking our lives. And after all United is a Corporate America. They don’t care about their bottom workers. Like many Corporate Americas, they will find any reason to dump higher paid workers just so they can hire new and lower paid workers. Why would they need to give an effort to give them visas while so many qualified US citizens/residents are available for a lower pay scale? Even if they allow transfer to LHR, they can only work for 3 years if they don’t hold the European citizenship. Thus the same issue will rise again. Keeping LHR is understandable considering the number of flights and limited lodging availability.
From the way you write, one must assume you – even after “30 years” in America, apparently – are a foreigner yourself.
United foreign based FAs have provided some of the best customer service. Bring them back.